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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.158.238.131
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 07:14 pm:   

I just watched Peter Tatchell confronting Nick Griffin...I wanted to cheer!

Go Tatchell! - You tell the odious little bastard!

gcw
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Mark_lynch (Mark_lynch)
Username: Mark_lynch

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.171.129.69
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 07:59 pm:   

Where'd he do that, GCW? I know Griffen's invitation to Buck Palace was pulled at the last minute, after he'd been promising to seek the Queen's opinions on immigration. Tatchell tried to arrest Mugabe a few years ago, got beaten up by his minders, and then taken away by the cops. The guy's got balls.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.23.91.114
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 08:02 pm:   

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-10729194
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.158.238.131
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 09:12 pm:   

A magnificent display of a man with integrity standing up to a gutless coward for sure, Sometimes I find Peter Tatchell a bit over the top in his opinions, but here, I am with him all the way & it cheered me to watch that clip.

gcw
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Simon Bestwick (Simon_b)
Username: Simon_b

Registered: 10-2008
Posted From: 86.24.209.217
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 10:25 pm:   

Tatchell's a brave, principled man, and I wish there were a hundred more like him in this archipelago of the cowardly and the self-absorbed.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.23.91.114
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 10:27 pm:   

The Silly Isles?
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 109.79.87.137
Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 10:56 pm:   

I'm a bit torn here. It's a principled and heartening intervention - and it's nice to see some genuine feeling in politics.

On the other hand, Tatchell has always struck me as rather shrill and the collection of badges and pins on his jacket gives him more than a passing resemblence to Rik from The Young Ones.
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 91.110.163.37
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 12:53 am:   

Except that Rik poses as an activist and Tatchell is the real thing.
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Zed (Gary_mc)
Username: Gary_mc

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.166.117.210
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 09:12 am:   

Who's Peter Tatchell?
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.23.91.114
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 09:26 am:   

Hey, look, he's objecting because he's being kept out of somewhere: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-10728148

Maybe he thinks there's indiscriminate prejudice at work.
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 109.79.100.182
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 09:45 am:   

He still claims to represent the "real" Britain. Even the Queen is telling him to fuck off.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.93.21.74
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 12:19 pm:   

I think the Queen actually said "Oh, do go away, you odious little man."

I like the way that the number of people who have voted BNP grows by about 200,000 between two of his interviews yesterday. Maybe it's a sympathy vote, eh? We must sympathise with him for suffering discrimination.
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.37.199.45
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 01:59 pm:   

Zed Peter Tatchell is a former Labour Party activist who was kept out of Parliament by a homophobic Liberal Democrat smear campaign in a by-election. Since then he's become a well-known spokesman for gay rights, and more widely for human rights. Famously he attempted a 'citizen's arrest' of Robert Mugabe in England, and was severely beaten by Mugabe's bodyguards which left him blinded in one eye. He also argued publicly with the SWP's Lindsey Germain, claiming that the party had a selective approach to human rights issues. He currently supports the Green Party but has always kept his own counsel.

Tatchell's difficulty is that he is usually only asked by the media to comment on gay rights issues this inevitably makes him sound more one-noted than he really is. A gay satirical magazine of the 1990s, ff, described him as 'the semi-skimmed Harvey Milk' though by their standards that was almost affectionate.
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Matthew Fryer (Matthew_fryer)
Username: Matthew_fryer

Registered: 08-2009
Posted From: 90.202.180.87
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 08:20 pm:   

I have a lot of respect for Peter Tatchell. Which grew immensely after the Mugabe incident, and again now he's confronted the ghastly Griffin.
He's been punched in the mouth so many times even eating causes him pain, but he refuses to bow to bigots.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 88.111.129.71
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 08:52 pm:   

'I have a lot of respect for Peter Tatchell. Which grew immensely after the Mugabe incident, and again now he's confronted the ghastly Griffin.
He's been punched in the mouth so many times even eating causes him pain, but he refuses to bow to bigots.'

I feel the same. He is a brave man.
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 212.49.212.18
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 11:21 pm:   

Joel - I'm glad you mentioned the way the media twist the public perception of Tatchell. Spot on.
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Seanmcd (Seanmcd)
Username: Seanmcd

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 86.154.129.209
Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 11:24 pm:   

Living in Belfast we have had,and still do have, extreme right wing bigots in every level of government now also including ex IRA leaders. A process which was underwritten by her Majesty's govt no less. If we have learned anything these last 10 years its that everyone has a right to be heard. Preventing a legitimately elected MP from exercising their rights surely is wrong? It can only breed resentment and anger among their grassroots which, i can guarantee you, will lead to more violence against the communities perceived to be 'gaining' more rights while they 'lose' theirs. Stop giving them this publicity for goodness sake! let them stand on their soapboxes and speak. let them be seen for what they are!
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.152.195.101
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 12:33 am:   

"extreme right wing bigots in every level of government now also including ex IRA leaders"

I'm probably misinterpreting your sentence, but the republicans are extreme left-wing bigots, aren't they?
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Seanmcd (Seanmcd)
Username: Seanmcd

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 86.154.129.209
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 02:20 am:   

Yes Proto. My point being even the two extremes in NI have accepted opposing views as valid. As long as those views no longer fall foul of the law of the land and the people holding them are democratically elected. You can't make someone go away by ignoring them or pretending their grassroots don't exist. In the case of dear old Nick he will no doubt secure more support after what has happened. The BNP will have another drum to beat.
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Stevie Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.17.252.126
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 03:41 am:   

Republicans in Ireland who support the use of armed force are fascists every bit as much as their "loyalist" counterparts!

I had to battle my way through republican bully-boys massed outside polling stations, demanding to know who you were about to vote for in west Belfast enough times to know that for sure...

Things are getting better, and I applaud Sinn Fein & the [real] IRA for the steps they have taken but I will never let them forget that if they had only let the peaceful civil rights movement have their way in the late 60s/early 70s we all would have been spared decades of bloodshed and accumulated hatred. Bloody Sunday could have been turned to good if we'd only held firm and not fallen for the bait... ah, human nature.

As Peter Tactchell's next project I'd like to see him take on the Queen and demand to know why Catholics in the (so called) United Kingdom are still deemed unfit to marry a member of her blessed family. I mean.. do we smell or something?

Time to put all this superstitious bollocks about "difference" to bed, don't ya think...
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 91.110.247.77
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 10:55 am:   

I don't think Sinn Fein is very left-wing: it doesn't have a Marxist perspective or socialist policies. Where it has (arguably) been extreme it has not been socialist, and where it has (arguably) been socialist it has not been extreme.

Sectarianism is incompatible with the core socialist perspective of uniting all workers regardless of religion or race. Which I hesitate to describe as 'extreme', since it seems to me the only sane perspective.
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 109.79.28.147
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 11:47 am:   

"Where it has (arguably) been extreme it has not been socialist, and where it has (arguably) been socialist it has not been extreme."

That's true.

Still, their default position is left-leaning. Witness the bizarre sight of middle-eastern flags fluttering on Belfast housing estates: Palestian flags for the nationalists, Israeli for the unionists. Bonkers.

Now here's a thing. Since WW2 talk of totalitarianism and political extremism seems to be synonymous with fascism. Yet extreme left-wing dictators of the 20th century have murdered more people than the extreme right. Why is facism evoked so often when the mass murders committed by Stalin and Mao exceed those of Hitler?

Is it because "we" only fought a war with Hitler? Is it because he didn't confine the murder to his own people?

I may be wrong here, but fascism overtly favours war as a positive tempering force on society while communism does not. But that's of little comfort to the bodies still curled up in the Russian permafrost.
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 109.79.28.147
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 11:52 am:   

"You can't make someone go away by ignoring them or pretending their grassroots don't exist."

Absolutely. The views of BNP supporters need to be addressed as seriously as any other citizen's. That may involve (unbiased) information and it must involve keeping open-minded. Maybe they have a point about something that we can learn from.
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Seanmcd (Seanmcd)
Username: Seanmcd

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 81.157.112.89
Posted on Saturday, July 24, 2010 - 12:06 pm:   

Joel, you're absolutely right. That's why the IRA split in the early 70's after Bloody Sunday. The 'Official' IRA held Marxist principles and didn't want to get involved in a sectarian war for the reasons you stated. They could see the trap waiting of NIs issues being labelled as an internal sectarian issue (i.e. 'troubles' what an understatement)rather than an issue of Empire. They declared a ceasefire and went into politics as the 'Workers' party. The Provos, on the other hand,didn't care who they targeted worker or not which, as Stevie points out, only inflamed the situation and prolonged it for 30 more years.

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