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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2012 - 07:29 pm:   

Anyone here with a dead relative? How would you feel if it turned out they hadn't really died, then got back in touch?
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 2.24.10.109
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2012 - 08:50 pm:   

Don't take this the wrong way, Tony, but your question could have been more sensitively phrased. You can imagine how someone would feel. Confused, scared, afraid they were going mad. Unable to be happy because the loved person was dead, they saw him or her in the coffin, there was a funeral, so what kind of reality allows them to be still alive? It's an upsetting line of thought and you should pursue it in a story, not poke at other people's wounds with it. Sorry mate.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2012 - 09:10 pm:   

Sorry, Tony, but I agree with Joel. This is something I have sometimes wondered re my own situation, but not something I'd ever want to talk about in public. Way too painful.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 05:26 pm:   

???

Am I missing something, or are you two just having a go at Tony?...

Because Tony just said "relative"—surely we've all had multiple annoying as hell relatives! The kind who, if they ever came back, first thing you'd want to know from them is if they'd told anyone else yet they were alive; so that if not, you could go meet them in that cemetery they were buried in, late at night, with a gun and a shovel....
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 05:40 pm:   

Craig - thank God for your response! I was starting to feel like Adam Sandler in Anger Management, in that scene in the plane.
I lost both my parents in the space of a terrible year, but the above question felt completely reasonable to me. I'm sure we've all asked it of ourselves. I honestly can't see the problem with it. Also, hasn't it been dealt with in the film Solaris in a way that didn't cause very much outrage? I am still reeling a bit from this reaction, to be honest.
I was thinking of writing it into a story. And not a horror, by any means.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 06:12 pm:   

It sounded more like a logline to a cheesy thriller, Tony (I mean, your original 2nd question). I thought it a reasonable question that brings up lots of potential, from the cheesy thrilling, to the philosophical....

But yeah, I mean, for a board that wallows in such realms of horror as zombies films, say; which regularly feature recent relatives rising up as rotting reeling moaning pain-enthralled corpses that proceed to munch down on your blood-spurting flesh... your loving mum gleefully tearing your body to shreds in order to pull free whole handfuls of slippery entrails she can't gobble down fast enough ... well, need I go on?
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 06:16 pm:   

Also, I did mean just really finding out a mistake had been made, and there they were.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 06:19 pm:   

OK, maybe I took it too personally (and perhaps so did Joel?). I won't comment further on this. I definitely wasn't having a go at Tony. It did upset me because of my own personal situation.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 06:30 pm:   

Sorry Caroline. I'm not good at getting my points across. :-(
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 06:44 pm:   

Don't worry, Tony. It's just that sometimes with me some things hit home just a little bit too hard.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 12:16 am:   

Caroline; I've just remembered your circumstances and apologise wholeheartedly. I am so sorry. Yes, some life situations - we do need to pussyfoot around.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 12:27 am:   

Like I said, don't worry about it. I wouldn't have commented at all but for Joel's post making me think it wasn't just me taking it too personally. I just kind of assumed that everyone with a dead relative would feel the same as me. But most people probably come to terms with situations - I haven't, not even after more than 40 years.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 12:30 am:   

That's it - situations are different for different people. I just didn't think. :-(
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 01:20 am:   

Tony, please stop the sad blue face thing. It's OK. I'm oversensitive on this issue. No harm done. Now, will somebody please answer Tony's question and I'll withdraw from this thread?
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David_lees (David_lees)
Username: David_lees

Registered: 12-2011
Posted From: 92.22.61.240
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 01:49 am:   

Probably better than if they HAD really died then got back in touch...
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.8.17.11
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:58 am:   

Yes, Craig, you're missing something. Some of us have lost relatives we loved very much and wish they hadn't died so soon (or so recently). For Christ's sake!

I've been away for two weeks without my password, incidentally, hence my silence on other threads where I would otherwise have responded or intervened.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 03:54 pm:   

Apologies, then, if I've offended anyone....

First, I wonder if part of this is a cultural thing? I'm going by Tony's original posting—he uses the term "relative." Does that term have the same exact meaning there in Britain? Because here, in that context especially, one would never include under "relative," immediate family members including siblings, father and mother (and even grandfather/mother). You'd say, here, "family member" for anyone that's a close relationship: I just assumed, by that very term used, it wasn't a close one, that meant it would encompass no-joking boundaries.

Further in my defense, indeed, I thought this was a horror board where we talked about such ghastly subjects openly?... From experience, it seems less a pub even, than more often a stand-up open-mike.

Thirdly, people, seriously—I'm not on Facebook, I don't know any of you personally, I don't even read every thread—I have absolutely no idea what's going on in your personal lives! (And you have no idea what's going on in mine.) Do you really think I set out to intentionally pour salt in your wounds? How now can I possibly make my What do you call it when you cross a cat flung off a building with the pavement it lands on below? A "splatapuss" joke, for fear now one of you recently lost a beloved cat?! It puts an awful damper on feeling free and easy and open here....

But if I inadvertently said something in jest that seemed to cross the line with someone... I apologize.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:11 pm:   

Craig - you're right. On this board people keep saying 'oh, there's nothing we shouldn't write about'.
My feelings are that I have no idea how to go on on here now. My thread opener was meant to be taken as, you know, an idea. Like I said, Solaris and I'm sure any number of stories have dealt with this subject and so it does bemuse me why it's seen as tasteless. Painful for some, it's true - but like you say, this is a horror board where a recurrent kind of idea will crop up.
This has turned to rubbish. I've lost the ability to understand people.
Again - I've lost relatives, and am set to probably lose another, but really? Saying my question was in bad taste to the extreme people seem to suggest it was makes me think it's time to go.
If people are so sensitive (I am myself, God knows it) maybe avoid, you know, *'horror'*?
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.42.48.84
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:12 pm:   

I meant anyone related to you, btw.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:43 pm:   

I too, Tony, feel like I've wandered into some kind of Cloud Cuckoo Land, where everyone already knows in advance the constantly-changing rules governing conversation... except me.... I had no idea a board that had such avid fans of, say, The Human Centipede would then have their hackles up on any given topic.

But no, I'm sorry, I still can't believe Joel's response above could be anything but the most sublime example of super-subtle humor yet on display! I mean, read that response again—Jesus, he's having a massive go at us! And now I look like a complete moron for falling into it.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.8.19.54
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:44 pm:   

Forgive me to this extent, Craig - I didn't mean that you should know about any such losses, just that they should be taken into account.

My dictionary defines "relative" as someone related to you by "blood or marriage".

May I ask people to reread what Joel and Caroline said?
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.8.19.54
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:46 pm:   

Sorry - my reply was actually posted before Craig's from a minute previously showed up. No, Craig, I don't think Joel was joking.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 04:56 pm:   

Okay, Ramsey, points taken.

This is your board, in the end, and you set the rules. I will respect them. I'd rather be here, than not. And God knows, I never mean to harm anyone's feelings by anything I've expressed.

(... though I admit to taking some small pleasure in how zanily my moon-landing-denial theories set Proto off—he's half the reason I sometimes doubt we ever even went there!...)
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Protodroid (Protodroid)
Username: Protodroid

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 147.252.230.148
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 05:22 pm:   

Well your transmissions do sound like they come from another planet, Craig.

I think the substance of this debate is more about the tone in which things are said rather than their content.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 05:25 pm:   

I find it weird that you guys (Tony, Craig) don't understand this. Craig - in my eyes, "relatives" means anyone related to you. I lost my sister to suicide over 40 years ago and it's something which has haunted me ever since. That's why Tony's question upset me. I definitely wasn't joking with my post, or trying to "have a go" at Tony - and I'm sure Joel wasn't either.

But of course none of you were likely to know about my situation - that's understood. I had mentioned it here before a long time ago, but none of you actually know me so it's highly understandable that Tony forgot. I took the initial question way too personally - thinking that he knew about my situation and was being insensitive, but I was wrong, he didn't and he wasn't.

All this talk about why are we into horror if we're so sensitive is a bit daft imo. There's a BIG difference between horror fiction and real-life horror and tragedy.
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Weber (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.66.23.11
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 06:09 pm:   

I must admit when I saw the question that started this thread even I thought "Ooh that could be phrased more tactfully!"

It's a reasonable question, there's some good ideas floating in there, but just the wording was a bit off...
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 06:13 pm:   

Now, where's the "like" button like they have on Facebook. I want to "like" the following two comments:

>>>"I think the substance of this debate is more about the tone in which things are said rather than their content."

>>>"I must admit when I saw the question that started this thread even I thought "Ooh that could be phrased more tactfully!"

It's a reasonable question, there's some good ideas floating in there, but just the wording was a bit off..."
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.37.199.45
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 06:41 pm:   

Tony, my father was killed in an accident caused by the negligence of an engineer almost ten years ago. The engineer was fined but did not lose his job.

I still feel your question was stupid and crassly phrased. I'm not apologising for anything, and I'm afraid that playing the victim does not improve your dignity.

Craig, your lack of basic human intelligence is becoming an increasingly disturbing aspect of this board.
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 114.25.190.50
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 06:58 pm:   

I felt exactly the same way as Joel and Caroline when I saw this thread. What's so hard to understand about what constitutes a relative, and the pain which reading this may bring to people (like me) who've recently lost loved ones?

A little thought and basic sensitivity goes a long way. I mean, how is one to respond to 'anyone have a dead relative?'?
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 114.25.190.50
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 07:05 pm:   

Craig, some of your comments here astound me. Do you honestly not see the difference between our ability to enjoy zombie movies and the very real tragedy of losing a loved one to an accident, say, or to cancer?
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 07:24 pm:   

For some reason, Tony has unfriended me on Facebook. What the hell? It's all beyond me. I'm off to play with my dogs. They're sane.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 07:27 pm:   

Same here, Gary - and he says he's left the RCMB. Shame he feels that way. I feel kind of responsible in a way - I should have just ignored this thread when he asked the question.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 07:47 pm:   

And now his wife is saying that the RCMB is full of "people who are running away from any real contact with real people" and have "the same kind of 'conversations' over and over again with a small narrow group of people".

I guess that puts us all - every member who's ever frequented this board since its inception in 2001 - in our place.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 07:56 pm:   

She said that before he "unfriended" us and left Gary. Let's not have a go at him, please. I like Tony.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:00 pm:   

Maybe I'm just protective of this board. I've been here since the start, and have seen a lot of worthwhile things here. I've made a lot of good friends, too - Gary Mc, Mark Lynch, Mick Curtis, more. I don't take kindly to folk who dismiss it in a condescending manner, and that's not just on this occasion. I'd say the same about anyone who dissed it.
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.183.255.159
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:16 pm:   

"Mick Curtis, more"

....guess I come somewhere after "more"....

Gcw :-)
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:18 pm:   

GCW, my guardian angel. How I love him. He helped me up off the floor. He's the king. No lie.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:27 pm:   

I stand by Tony. I barely know him, haven't even met or talked to him like many of you. But I wouldn't pile on him like you all did, for phrasing something you perceive indelicately.

I guess my basic understanding that people here aren't by nature cruel or vicious, would never make me go that route. I couldn't take offense at it.

But then, my own navel, I guess, does not fill my horizons.

How do any of you know, that I've not had people close to me pass away in tragic or sad or terrible circumstances? You don't.

Look. If you all just don't like me hanging around these parts—please, understand, this is not self-pity I'm driving at; I'm just trying to understand—I mean it, say so. I'm fine with leaving, I'll take no offense. I get it. Some people just rub others the wrong way. There's the door, say the word, and you can be rid of me forever... no harm done, no questions asked....
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Jamie Rosen (Jamie)
Username: Jamie

Registered: 11-2008
Posted From: 173.32.63.252
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:29 pm:   

I have a possibly tactless question: is Tony in therapy? He often seems to be battling depression and various other mental difficulties (I say this as someone who is doing so himself, so I'm not attempting to cast aspersions or throw stones.)

I know that when I'm in the midst of a particularly bad depressive episode, I will occasionally say/post things that are beyond the norms of acceptability.

As for the original question, I'd probably have a mental breakdown. I have dreams along those lines quite regularly, but it'd be something else entirely to experience it in real life, especially since none of my dead relatives (all four grandparents, my mother, an infant cousin) are not of the "Missing presumed dead" variety.

On the cultural side of things, I don't know where you live, Craig, but here in my part of Canada a relative is anyone who's related to you.

And, finally, I'd have thought it was self-evident that an internet message board is not the place to go to have "real contact with real people." You have to leave the house for that.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 08:53 pm:   

"But I wouldn't pile on him like you all did, for phrasing something you perceive indelicately."

Craig - I hope I wasn't "piling on him". I tried to express my feelings gently, although I was a bit upset at the time. I certainly didn't intend to "pile on him". I really hope he doesn't feel that I did - but then I guess he probably does.

"Look. If you all just don't like me hanging around these parts—please, understand, this is not self-pity I'm driving at; I'm just trying to understand—I mean it, say so. I'm fine with leaving, I'll take no offense. I get it. Some people just rub others the wrong way. There's the door, say the word, and you can be rid of me forever... no harm done, no questions asked...."

I really hope you don't decide to go as well. I often think there are some cultural differences going on when you get into arguments with other folk here, Craig. We all need to understand and respect cultural differences.

"I have a possibly tactless question: is Tony in therapy? He often seems to be battling depression and various other mental difficulties (I say this as someone who is doing so himself, so I'm not attempting to cast aspersions or throw stones.)"

I'm not sure we should be trying to answer that - only Tony can do that if he wishes to do so. But I do take your point, Jamie.
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Jamie Rosen (Jamie)
Username: Jamie

Registered: 11-2008
Posted From: 173.32.63.252
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 10:29 pm:   

You're right, Caroline.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.9.247.54
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 10:43 pm:   

'...the RCMB is full of "people who are running away from any real contact with real people" and have "the same kind of 'conversations' over and over again with a small narrow group of people"...'

I'm afraid I think that's an ignorant observation. Let me not seem offensive: I mean one based on a lack of knowledge. I'm ignorant of many things myself. But really, to represent people's interaction on a message board as the whole of their experience seems a little extreme.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 202.174.163.204
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:24 pm:   

'Anyone here with a dead relative?' Insensitive. Yes. Lost my mother and sister and miss then very much.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:24 pm:   

Caroline, you certainly weren't piling on him, I don't think.

But rather than take this as an attack anyone (god knows my buckler's full of arrows at the moment), can we just lend Tony a little bit of slack here?

Why did anyone assume the worst in his initial question? I didn't—I am genetically incompatible, perhaps, with taking personal offense... most of the time, I am....

Gary, was it fair to repost publicly something his wife said here? Regardless of what she said, I'm just not sure that's playing fair; you might have redirected us to her comments if they were publicly posted elsewhere (if they even were...?). But sorry, Gary, here's an example where *I* find something posted to be of poor taste: reproducing another's words, without the permission of the author, in order to heap outrage upon her and her "relative."

This entire thread seems to have instead resurrected all our worst spirits. Proto's the only one that comes off with a genial sense of humor!
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.110.13.182
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:24 pm:   

This is Marie. I have had to log in as Tony since, although this page is publicly viewable, only registered users can comment. Maybe that should mean that registered users therefore shouldn't make comments about people who are not registered users.
The way that Gary has selected two quotes from a couple of messages we exchanged completely misrepresents my views. I don't think he has done this deliberately. Ramsey Campbell; you can therefore consider whether your statement about commenting from a point of ignorance should be bounced back at you.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.9.247.54
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:27 pm:   

I've already admitted I can be ignorant, Marie. What did you actually say?
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John Forth (John)
Username: John

Registered: 05-2008
Posted From: 82.24.1.217
Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 - 11:39 pm:   

Really, this thread should have farted itself out after the first two (fair, and fairly-worded) responses. No one was "having a go" at Tony, and to be honest I doubt anyone would have thought so until Craig came steaming in.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 12:51 am:   

"Why did anyone assume the worst in his initial question?"

I've already answered that from my point of view, Craig - because it touched a raw nerve with me. But surely it would touch a raw nerve with anyone who has a dead relative they really wish wasn't dead? Sorry Craig (and Tony, in absentia), but I just can't see how you can't understand that point of view.

And, yes, whoever said that Gary shouldn't have posted Marie's comments from FB I totally agree with that - which is why I said "please don't have a go at Tony" (perhaps I should have added Marie too?) immediately after his post.

You know, this has been a really weird day on the internet. Along with all this, I've also had a vaguely veiled threat from someone on a fibromyalgia page on FB.
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 2.24.10.82
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 01:24 am:   

Marie – I had no intention of shoving Tony off the RCMB, and don't want that to be the outcome. I was expressing my feelings honestly, that's all. I'd expect the same of him and anyone else.

Craig – no, I'm not trying to push you out either. I just think you may have trouble connecting reason and emotion. As long as you stop and think before you post, that's all I ask.

I'm going to leave this board alone for a while. Take care and take it easy, friends.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.110.13.182
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 02:41 am:   

Marie Again! – this is HUGE by the way so skip it all if you like…especially the people who feel they want to revisit a thread and read it all and post that there’s no point to the posts – except their own presumably?
ha ha - just woke up to the podcast of Tuesday's episode of 'Paul Temple and the Geneva Mystery" on radio 4 extra, the closing lines of which are; "But Mrs *** how do you know your husband is alive", "Because I just spoke to him on the telephone"!!!!
Would it have made a difference is the question had been phrased; "Many forms of fiction and several real life cases deal with situations where a person who was presumed to be dead is subsequently found not to be, how do we think the relatives of such a person might feel?" Tony wouldn't see the difference between that and his question but then he is either very probably autistic or an insensitive w*nk*r depending on how much he has annoyed me that day. My genuine anger on face book was all directed at Tony. For the record, I wrote that I was frustrated with Tony spending time "feeding people who were avoiding real contact with real people" I did not say this board was 'full of them' - that was Gary's addition. I did not mention RCMB, did not mean only RCMB members or exclusively RCMB members (although I can completely understand why Gary took it that way – I was addressing my comments to Tony who would know what I meant by ‘that lot’) but perhaps more importantly I did not say or mean that avoiding real contact with real people was a bad thing - on the contrary I think it's often the only sensible thing to do. I was criticising Tony for spending time feeding people who want or need to do that purely because it's not good for him and I resent the consequences of it for my family and myself. I did say that this board has a small and narrow group of people having the same conversations over and over again and I would stand by that observation based on my previous membership of the board and my periodical episodes as a public viewer. Again I wouldn't suggest that is a bad thing per se - it's to be expected in a fan site - crucially though I only actually wrote that as a response to Gary saying he and others used the board for work...it seemed odd to me for a uni professor to use it for that purpose - though he has since clarified that he didn't mean he uses it for work exactly (he can explain if he chooses what he meant but it might rather bear out my first point!).
Caroline; I could take offence at you saying that “surely it would touch a raw nerve with anyone who has a dead relative they really wish wasn't dead?” – are you saying that because Tony’s question didn’t touch a raw nerve with me I don’t really wish my Mother was alive? But of course I can see you are a kind and reasonable person and I am too, so I assume you didn’t mean that, and as a responsible adult I choose not to take offence. I’m sorry you have had a bad experience on FB – message boards do seem to foster that response…. Perhaps because some people feel they have nothing to lose by falling out with others while others feel they lose everything when they do?
Since others have shared their experience of losing close relations I share that Tony was the one to find his father dead in a pool of blood one morning and his mother died in his arms unexpectedly a few years later. He (unsuccessfully obviously) performed CPR on her until the ambulance arrived. Maybe the unequivocal nature of their deaths meant that he took it as obvious that he was talking hypothetically – I aint defending him by the way; I do mostly think he behaves like a complete idiot. But his hurt from this and his contrition has given me a gleaming microwave and a hovered bedroom so it’s all good
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 03:03 am:   

That's a wonderful, poignant and clear response, Marie. You seem like a lovely lady, and Tony suddenly seems quite fortunate.

Joel, thanks. I'm probably very much guilty of that—failing to connect reason with emotion—and will endeavor to think before I post, before just assuming everyone's on the same wavelength I am. Or, gets my blind stabs at humor.

Huw, yes to your question, I do; so I guess refer to my above paragraph. Everyone else I may have offended, the same.

http://youtu.be/BGLR25EJtfE
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 09:25 am:   

I made some comments here this morning, but have decided, on reflection, to delet them. It's none of my business. I was simply trying to defend the RCMB.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 09:28 am:   

But I maintain that I did not misrepresent comments made elsewhere. They did seem to me to be offensive to RCMB members. But short of quoting them, which folk find objectionable, there's nothing I can do. I can't link to a Facebook page, because only Tony's "friends" will see it, and that's probably nobody now.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 11:24 am:   

Marie - sorry my comment offended you, that wasn't my intention. I was only saying what I feel and how I can't understand how Tony and Craig can't understand how someone could get upset by Tony's question.

I'm really sorry it's all come to this. I wish I'd never commented on this thread at all - I should have just ignored it completely when it upset me. Joel seemed to me to be quite legitimately trying to point out to Tony the offence it might cause, and then I (inappropriately,it seems) jumped in and agreed with him.

Anyway, I really AM going to leave this thread alone now as I can't cope with it any more. I hope Tony will come back to the board and FB one day, if he feels it's right for him at that time.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 92.8.18.126
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 11:36 am:   

Thanks for all that, Marie.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 99.126.164.88
Posted on Friday, September 21, 2012 - 04:41 pm:   

Alright everyone, on three:

One, two...

http://youtu.be/6S8tc6y0uvQ
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.110.13.182
Posted on Sunday, September 23, 2012 - 12:59 pm:   

Marie again;
Caroline; if you read this, no apology is neccessary - I wasn't offended by your comment as I could see that although I could technically take what you had written and find offence in it I could also see that you didn't mean that and so I chose to interpret your words in a way that didn't offend me. We don't need to understand how or why people feel differently to us - just allow it to be.
Gary; I do wholeheartedly apologise to you that you were offended by my comments. They were not intended to be offensive to anyone other than my husband - and as you say they were on his FB page which is only viewable by a small number of people. You misinterpretted what I meant but I can understand why you would have done that not being privvy to discussions that Tony and I have had which places my comments in context.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.31.88.121
Posted on Sunday, September 23, 2012 - 01:56 pm:   

Don't worry, Marie. Best of luck. Hope Tony's OK.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 92.232.244.38
Posted on Sunday, September 23, 2012 - 05:35 pm:   

What Gary said. Marie and Tony - hope you're both fine and dandy.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.110.13.182
Posted on Sunday, September 23, 2012 - 07:10 pm:   

Marie again, that's all good then. Just for the avoidance of doubt I have added this to the 'offending'(!)status on fb; "As I have offended someone with my comments above I need to clarify that any negative connotations inferred by the phrases "people running away from real contact with real people" and "small narrow group of people having the same 'conversations' over and over" should be taken as applying only to those people who engage in those activities while repeatedly promising and failing to fix the curtain rail in the office or re-tune my dad's telly so it gets diginal. Anyone not meeting those crieria feel free to carry on, I mean you no harm :-)"
We're all fine thanks. I ran into the north sea naked yesterday morning with 100 odd other people....still ended up going home with Tony though :-)

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