| Author | Message | ||
     Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Before heading off to London on the train ther other day, I bought the new King collection and devoured most of it en route. I confess that I haven't read much King since 2003, and I was delighted to reconnect with him. Few of the tales here are blazingly original or groundbreaking, but it's that voice - wonderful. I loved 'Stationary Bike' and 'The Things They Left Behind', while 'The Gingerbread Girl opens with some quintessential Kingian passages. A renewed delight. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Of course it would help if I got the fucking title right: JUST AFTER SUNSET. Dickhead. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.253.172 |
I'm finding King's columns in Entertainment Weekly wearying, frankly. It feels like he's struggling to maintain a youthful "hip" tone of voice; and all he does is praise this thing he's read, or that thing he's seen, or that thing he's heard -- Oh wait, that's you Gary.  (I'm KIDDING!... but I really do feel that way about King lately) | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Allow me to relent in my praise, Craig... | ||
| Karim Ghahwagi (Karim) Username: Karim Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 80.167.124.223 |
Reading the collection now and enjoying it | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.242.126 |
I hope to get this for Christmas. Haven't read King's articles, but I never tire of his fictional voice. It's like hearing the dad I never had inside my head. | ||
| Chris_morris (Chris_morris) Username: Chris_morris Registered: 04-2008 Posted From: 12.165.240.116 |
I'm with you, Zed. There's something paternal about King's voice, especially for people of our generation. (Not that my father was awful -- just that King always seemed better.) Joe Hill's a lucky guy to actually have the real McCoy. I remember reading once, don't recall where, that King's success owed much to the introductions he wrote for Night Shift and Skeleton Crew and to the nonfiction book Dance Macabre; that he was able to use those forums to reach out to his "Constant Readers" as a person, not just as a creator of fiction, in a way that his novels wouldn't allow. I think there's some truth to that. Before him, and in much the same way, Harlan Ellison used introductions and nonfiction material to emerge from the authorial shadows as an engaging human being. I think King learned a lot from him. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.16.78.185 |
...he was able to use those forums to reach out to his "Constant Readers" as a person, not just as a creator of fiction, in a way that his novels wouldn't allow.... So when is the reigning Great Wise Man of horror going to write his nonfiction opus of views/reflections upon the genre, past, present and future?... ... You know whom you are, oh Great Wise Man....  | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.157.53.174 |
Yes - I used to love finding King had written an intro. It was often my favourite bit. Nearly flipped when Danse Macabre came out, and I love it still. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.195.235 |
Danse Macabre is one reason why critics who claim King's relationship to the weird fiction genre is opportunistic (it sold, so he wrote it, but never meant it) are talking toxic waste. It's a rich, passionate, intelligent love letter to the genre. King and his publishers have kept that book in print when it can't be doing as well as his novels. Year on year it's still out there, making its pitch for supernatural horror, telling new readers about Bradbury and Campbell and Lovecraft and Jackson and Matheson. And we are grateful. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.242.126 |
Danse Macabre introduced me to Ramsey, Harlan Ellison and many other now-favourite writers. I still have my old copy of the book, with passages underlined and highlighted. | ||
| Simon Strantzas (Nomis) Username: Nomis Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 99.225.111.224 |
I hate to be a "me too" guy, but DM is the only reason I tried Jackson or Straub or Campbell or Ellison. For our generation, I was pretty much THE textbook regarding what we should be reading. I'd almost argue that little book did more for the genre than any of his novels. And the more I think about it, the more I believe it! | ||
| John Llewellyn Probert (John_l_probert) Username: John_l_probert Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 90.199.0.113 |
I read DM when I was about 12. He trashed The Comeback, liked Frankenheimer's Prophecy, and said that Cronenberg made Rabid before Shivers. This King bloke knows piss all about films I thought. I await Gary Fry's "Dance MacBare" Actually no. No no no no no no. | ||
| Mark West (Mark_west) Username: Mark_west Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.39.177.173 |
Count me in for a "Danse Macabre" fan - through that, I was introduced to a lot of genre items that I probably wouldn't have discovered on my own. I wasn't going to try this collection, as I didn't think much to "Everything's Eventual". Is it a cut above that, do you think (anyone)? | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Similar, I'd say, Mark: one or two classics, a couple of curios, and some well-written ephemera. Oi, Probert: shut ya piehole. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Yep, Danse Mac for me, too. I even read books like Theroux's The Black House and Pynchon's V on King's rec. | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.78.5.111 |
DM - sat on the shelf above my desk. Wonderful. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 83.98.9.4 |
I want him to write the follow up, bringing it up to date with the last 26 years since it was published | ||
| Alansjf (Alansjf) Username: Alansjf Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 93.97.93.216 |
This makes me feel old. I used to carry around a photocopy of King's DM recommended reading list, hunting for those titles in charity and secondhand bookshops. That was the better part of 20 years ago. I'm still looking for that copy of Kneale's Tomato Cain... | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Zed - Actually I stand corrected on something I claimed earlier about King's short stories being all about the hook. I reread Night Shift last month and realised I was talking shit. Last Rung on the Ladder is beautiful. And from Nightmares and Dreamscapes, My Beautiful Pony is a minor masterpiece. See, mate, I am eating humble pie...once again. | ||
| Chris_morris (Chris_morris) Username: Chris_morris Registered: 04-2008 Posted From: 12.165.240.116 |
Gary F: I've read Theroux's Black House, but I didn't know King recommended it. Do you recall where King made the recommendation? (It's not in Danse Macabre, is it?) | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Sure is, mate. I liked Black House a good deal. Theroux's over stuff is worth a look, too. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 83.98.9.4 |
It is reccommended in Danse Macabre. I read it (black House) many years ago but can't remember a single detail about it except i thought it was unremarkable for Theroux. Chicago Loop on the other hand - he strays brilliantly into Patricia Highsmith territory and produces an amazing central psychopath. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
I have CL, W, but haven't read it yet. Thanx for the rec. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.5.6.253 |
DM came late to me: I discovered weird writers the old-fashioned way, by weave-reading hither and yon. I liked Lovecraft, so I picked up that old DAW anthology, THE DISCIPLES OF CTHULHU. That's where I read "The Tugging," and became an instant Campbell addict. And so on, in other places/ways. I didn't grow up revering King as king: he was always one more out there, and in fact, perhaps just a shade outside the meat of the genre - you know, like how Koontz and Rice, etc., are? - because of his huge pop presence. But just one more truly mighty master of the horror short-story (my main area of concentration), certainly: NIGHT SHIFT proved and still proves that.... | ||
| Chris_morris (Chris_morris) Username: Chris_morris Registered: 04-2008 Posted From: 12.165.240.116 |
I recall Black House being a bit Aickmanesque -- at least, there were scenes in which Theroux was quite deliberately vague about what was going on. I liked the book, and it led me to read a few other Theroux titles. I haven't read Danse Macabre in years (decades?), but my recollection is that in that book King states a general disapproval of Lovecraft (although I think he mentions that he liked him when he was young). Doesn't he also argue against the narrative strategies of classic horror? -- I believe he says he prefers explicit descriptions and does not like the horrific elements left to the imagination. (Maybe he was just talking about movies?) I can't recall him discussing Campbell at all. (I remember much about Shirley Jackson and Anne Rivers Siddon's The House Next Door.) Am I wrong? All this talk has made me want to dig out my bent and mangled paperback for a quick read-through. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Yes, he discusses R's first novel and alludes to The Parasite, too. Very perceptive review of R's nascent career. | ||
| Karim Ghahwagi (Karim) Username: Karim Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 80.167.124.223 |
'The Things They Left Behind' and 'Stationary Bike' are certainly great stories in this. 'Stationary Bike' really took me back to why I love reading King. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.5.11.249 |
I believe he says he prefers explicit descriptions and does not like the horrific elements left to the imagination. Not really.... He says that the monster behind the door is always going to be scarier, when it's still in an imagination making it ever more scary; when the door is opened, fear can only be diminished. However, King does say that horror must always open that door to be fully satisfying... and so, by extension.... | ||
| Simon Strantzas (Nomis) Username: Nomis Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 38.113.181.169 |
I could be mistaken, but I suspect King isn't tuned into the genre enough to write an updated version of the book. Someone else needs to write one. I nominate Joel. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.238.135 |
That's what I was saying above, Simon! Just insert Wise Man accordingly. | ||
| Simon Strantzas (Nomis) Username: Nomis Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 38.113.181.169 |
So that's two nominations for Joel! Awesome! | ||
| Steve Bacon (Stevebacon) Username: Stevebacon Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 90.209.220.40 |
My mouth is watering at the prospect of an 'updated' Danse Macabre, covering the period since the original was published. Even more so if it was written by Joel. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.167.144 |
I'm writing a book, THIS SPECTACULAR DARKNESS, about horror fiction and the twentieth century. But it won't be finished for five years at least, maybe more. It won't be anything like a full overview: it will contain about fifteen essays on individual writers or groups of writers, with a focus on the modernisers of weird fiction (Bradbury, Bloch, Leiber, Ellison, Aickman, Campbell) as well as the conventionally recognised 'Golden Age' (Machen, Blackwood, Hodgson, Lovecraft) and the somewhat neglected metaphysical ghost story strand (de la Mare, Onions, Metcalfe, Aickman). How far up to date I'll go remains to be seen, and it would be a mistake for me to try and cover the field as it is now. My essays in the Tartarus Press journal WORMWOOD are effectively chapters of this book. But don't hold your breath. My performance against schedule is atrocious. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Joel - I think five years is too damned long a time to wait, mate. Seriously, good luck and I'm 100% certain just how much everyone on this board and in the genre community await this book with eager anticipation, which in no time at all will gestate into an outright fever pitch of c'mon c'mon man, get that book out. I think everyone agrees there couldn't be a better or more qualified person to do so. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.205.243 |
That's very kind, Frank. But to be honest I'm just one more anorak among many, and I'm braced for all kind of negative reactions. I don't want to build this book up too much. It will praise some writers a lot of people don't like and ignore or disparage some others who are considered classic. By not trying to cover the whole field but sticking to what interests me most, I hope to minimise the negative reactions. And the timescale is a compromise between the lifetime I ought to devote to it and the good sense of getting it done while I still have some of my marbles (especially the cracked one with the reddish streak that looks like a demon eye) and our cities have not yet been devastated by environmental meltdown or chemical warfare. In five years' time I'll be 50 and have got my midlife crises out of the way, so it's a nice target. But the book will be short and selective, not a massive overview. I'd rather succeed on a smaller scale than fail on a bigger one. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Joel - nonsense,mate. I've never met a single fan or writer who doesn't praise your work or hold you in the highest esteem. If you're an anorak, then by god, you're certainly one hell of a gifted one. There'll come a day in the future when Joel Lane himself will be part of such a book. Your work speaks for itself. I'd give an arm or a leg to have a smidgen of your talent. Well, maybe not literally. | ||
| Karim Ghahwagi (Karim) Username: Karim Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 80.167.124.223 |
Frank I can mail you a cleaver...the one I have cuts through joints quite nicely. Seriously that sounds really excellent Joel. I'll try an send a letter to the CERN people that they should perhaps wait until The Spectacular Darkness comes out. All the very best with it. | ||
| Simon Bestwick (Simon_b) Username: Simon_b Registered: 10-2008 Posted From: 86.24.165.182 |
Joel- that book would be well worth reading, but I know how long you've been spending on just the Ellison section. I'd the first to agree with Frank, though, about your status within the genre. You might need to hire someone else to contribute a chapter about your work, otherwise it just won't be complete... I might have a spare demon-eye marble, though, if that would help. I'll have a look in the bedside drawer. | ||
| Simon Bestwick (Simon_b) Username: Simon_b Registered: 10-2008 Posted From: 86.24.165.182 |
Damn. It's not there. Maybe down the back of the sofa. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.162.125 |
Frank – again, you're very kind, but some of the harshest judgements on my work have come from within the genre. Darrell Schweitzer's review of THE LOST DISTRICT in FOUNDATION describes the contents as "formless chunks of prose" that are not even stories, let alone part of the weird fiction genre. And he's an established genre critic – worryingly, his pulp reading background is quite similar to mine, though I don't know what more recent fiction he appreciates. The genre contains a wide range of incompatible tastes and attitudes – not necessarily a bad thing. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Some of the harshest criticism MUST come from within genre if only because our contemporaries are those with a better and clearer understanding. BUT, I know plenty of other people, granted, perhaps not with Schweitzer's background, who have a completely different view to The Lost District, as they do about your other work. I realise compliments are a hard thing to acknowledge, but quite simply you're regarded as one of the most important writers working within the genre. Don't be so critical of yourself. Leave that to others. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
Joel's anorak is a fine one, and long may it rain. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Amen, Prof, amen! | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
You have to use puns with Joel - it's the only language he understands. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
I did, then I erased it for fear of my pun lacked the appropriate punningess with which your pun so clearly demonstrated. I'm crap at puns. My brain moves slowly at the best of times. Several weeks may elapse before I can think of a pun. I leave this much admired verbal jousting to you fellas. | ||
| Simon Bestwick (Simon_b) Username: Simon_b Registered: 10-2008 Posted From: 86.24.165.182 |
Don't be so harsh on yourself, Frank. Any pun will do when it's joust between friends. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.3.65.135 |
We call it punctured by a lance. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
See, see...ah. but to walk in the shoes of giants...even if for a moment... |