| Author | Message | ||
     Mick Curtis (Mick) Username: Mick Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.159.152.164 |
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/new-powers-for-police-to-hack-you r-pc-1225802.html | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Sadly I'm so dull it doesn't really worry me...  | ||
| Karim Ghahwagi (Karim) Username: Karim Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 80.167.124.223 |
Jep. Just finished editing a documentary on surveillance in London. Some US senators were pushing legislation a while back that would allow them to 'information bomb' and thus remote destroy pc's belongng to people they wanted to target for piracy offences. You have an illegal George Michael file and we small smite ye. Hope everyone had a cool Christmas and new years BTW. | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.33.227 |
Happy New Year Karim! So how much trouble can I get into for perusing sites for research purposes? :>) | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.33.227 |
Actually the more I think about it the more shocked I am. I know the discussion about if you have nothing to hide...but...mind you how able could the police be at this. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
But we grumbled so much about rising crime and nobody joined the police force! What they meant to do? It's like dark Knight all over again...  And is it me or are folk deliberately avoiding the Isreal thing? The governments, that is? Talk about burnt fingers, yeah? | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.152.21 |
Very true, Tony. Do what you can within your environment to raise awareness of what is going on. I haven't raised it here because it's too huge an issue for our quiet little snug (and I say that without sarcasm). But governments have no right to keep looking the other way. Or to keep saying 'both sides need to stop fighting'. Only one side is being wiped out. Mass slaughter of civilians is a war crime. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
I can only see another Iraq resulting, though. What a mess. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
We need some sort of United Nation-style thing, don't we? Hang on! | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.242.126 |
I'm going to admit my ignorance here; I don't understand the Isreal thing at all. Are both sides not at fault? hamas killing civilians, and now the Isrealies doing the same thing? Or do I have the wrong information? I've never understood this one: it's one of those issues that's simply too big; bigger than us all. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Hamas are bad. I could understand their being attacked. But then I've had a long think last night; if people don't want war they sould just fucking talk. In my selfish old age (and after the disdain that met us after Iraq and Afghanistan etc etc etc) I'm inclined to say let folk get on with it. | ||
| Huw (Huw) Username: Huw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 218.168.180.216 |
I'm not an expert on the subject, but as far as I understand it there is fault to be found on both sides. The US is biased toward Israel, and is often accused of failing to condemn or 'reign in' the Israelis when they go on the offensive. I think the whole thing is way too complicated to make generalisations about which side is ultimately to blame, though. Just my two cents. | ||
| Niki Flynn (Niki) Username: Niki Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 78.32.69.29 |
Maybe they only reveal stuff like this as "new" because they can't keep it a secret any more - when they've actually been watching us all along. Or maybe I'm just paranoid. Even though they ARE out to get me. And my little dog. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.228.60 |
In the current conflict, where one side has sustained nine casualties and the other side has lost 750 people, roughly 600 being civilians, and half a million people are dying of untreated injuries, starvation and exposure, whose 'fault' it is is really not the issue. Israel did not need to do this. Their blockade of the Gaza Strip over the last year has been an act of war in itself, and has led to this situation. Gaza was a humanitarian crisis before the bombing started. It's as if the British government had responded to IRA bombings in the 1970s by isolating and destroying the Catholic areas of Northern Ireland. The Rwandan genocide was blamed by the aggressors on the violence of the victims. When one side has so much power and is killing civilians on a huge scale, who is 'to blame' for the conflict is not the first issue. The first issue is that wiping out a civilian population is a war crime. Having some excuses makes no difference. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
But hasn't this been going on for generations? And isn't it - like most conflicts - to do with religion and land rights? Apologies if I'm incorrect - like I say, I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to this dispute. Never been able to get a grip on it. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
It does seem to me like an attempted genocide by Israel, though: those were the thoughts in my midn when the story broke. | ||
| Huw (Huw) Username: Huw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 218.168.180.216 |
I agree with Joel that this is unforgivable (and unnecessary) on Israel's part, regardless of what led up to it. I haven't been following it closely, so I won't say more (I'd probably just make a fool of myself). | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
"But hasn't this been going on for generations? And isn't it - like most conflicts - to do with religion and land rights?" Yes, and yes. But we are selling arms, trading goods and giving diplomatic support to one side only. If Israel is going to say "They're as bad as us," they – and we – have to accept that they simply do not have the moral high ground. What they do have is a sufficiency of arms to destroy the entire Arab world. For them to unleash that military power on a densely populated, practically unarmed civilian population trapped in a ghetto they have been closing in for a year is, to put it mildly, a disproportionate response. To put it less mildly, it's a massacre. Because nobody is innocent does not mean that anything goes. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
I agree completely; just wanted to make sure I agreed for the right reasons. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 212.121.214.11 |
Compare and contrast with Iraq, we lost a few hundred soldiers, multiply that number by 1000 for the number of Iraqi dead - mostly civilian - hrougj "Shock and Awe" tactics. In the first world war less than 10% ofd the war dead were civilian - in the second world war (where incidentally we dropped more bombs on Berlin than the Germans dropped on the whole of Britain) that number rose to 50% civilian dead - in recentr conflicts it seems the safest place to be is on the front line in a uniform as more than 90% of war deaths are now civilian. It's kinda scary | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 160.6.1.47 |
"It's as if the British government had responded to IRA bombings in the 1970s by isolating and destroying the Catholic areas of Northern Ireland." Actually, this isn't sci-fi. Margaret Thatcher toyed with just that idea -- removing Catholic Nationalists from Northern Ireland. Ethnic cleansing, basically. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
Being from the north east, I know a lot of people who will party through the night when that woman dies. I'll probably silently raise a fist in the air myself. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
That said, I would like to live in an 'ethically cleansed' place. Somewhere just with folk like myself. After the first world war it meant there were hardly any blokes left. It had a different effect on people. I often wonder where war comes from having lived in a country that's not really known any on such a scale as the aforementioned in my lifetime. For me, places that fight might as well be on alien worlds. | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 160.6.1.47 |
"That said, I would like to live in an 'ethically cleansed' place. Somewhere just with folk like myself." No you wouldn't. You'd drive you potty. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
I know - realised it as I wrote. Didn't stop me posting it, though. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Heck, just what is the answer? We're all assholes. | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 160.6.1.47 |
No we're not. Just keep on keeping on. Do your best at everything you attempt, be kind. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
Places that fight include us. We just drop bombs half a world away. Even in fun, please don't say that you would like to live in an ethnically cleansed place. There's only one way that would come about. It would leave 'us' culturally impoverished and 'them' (including several members of this board) dead or homeless. Who would be on which side depends on which arbitrary criteria were employed. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
Intervening exchange much better than my posting. | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 160.6.1.47 |
If anyone hasn't seen it yet, go and see Dean Spanley. Its gentle story on the transmigration of souls renders all talk of "us" and "them" silly. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Joel - I'd spelt it 'Ethically'. Thought it might go amiss. I know Proto - I'm just in a funny mood today. It'll pass.  (BTW for those who remember my daftness with 'foreign language posters' in shops, that polish cafe is now my favourite place in newcastle. So much atmosphere and nice, thoughtful touches like books and jigsaws on tables.) | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 212.121.214.11 |
Has anyone ever seen the Mitchell and Webb sketch with the two German officers in WWII slowly realising that they're the bad guys? Looking at the way this country behaves on the world stage at the moment - especially in places like Iraq - makes me really quite depressed. Our country is rapidly turning into the bad guy and there's fuck all any of us can do about it. | ||
| Jonathan (Jonathan) Username: Jonathan Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.143.178.131 |
Talking about hope amongst death. I was really really taken with In Bruges, that we watched last night. I was expecting a black comedy and what I got was a moving drama about redemption. Colin Farrell was astonishingly good in this and the bit where he breaks down when talking about accidentally killing a child is heart wrenching. A brilliant film. Beautifully written. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 212.121.214.11 |
Happy new year | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
Damn, I'm sorry, Tony. I missed the joke entirely. Not looking closely enough. | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 160.6.1.47 |
I missed it too! | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.239.177 |
Speaking of hacking and "ethic-cleansing" and movies and whatnot - I saw BURN AFTER READING - ha! The Coen's totally redeemed themselves from NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN. This one's a dystopian black-comedy, and comedy indeed, very funny... very black. Everyone is superb; I loved every moment And so far, unlike THE DARK KNIGHT, it's remaining nicely in my memory.... | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 212.121.214.11 |
Why do they need to redem themselves from NCFOM? It was one of my favourites last year. | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.58.102 |
Bloody Hell Jonathan! I watched it last night too and thought the same. I guessed how the last few scenes were going to pan out and loved it! Colin Farrell played just about the best I've ever seen him before. The script was tight, witty, very funny in parts and heart breaking in others. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Weber - I don't think we're the bad guys, or becoming bad. We're just screwed up and our sense of identity and role has been diminished by all sorts of forces - even ourselves. I think we are, as a whole, lacking confidence and esteem, and it makes us falter and hesitate when we should stride. Don't worry you guys - I guessed you had! | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.58.102 |
I really, really want to watch BURN AFTER READING Craig. I'll eventually get to it years after everyone else. | ||
| Jonathan (Jonathan) Username: Jonathan Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.143.178.131 |
No Country For Old Men was utterly utterly terrifying. Very good indeed but about the bleakest thing I saw last year. Burn After Reading is more light heated fun, but still well worth a watch. Got Them to watch tonight and tomorrow night I'm off to see the Boosh. Huzzah! | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Lower your expectations, Jon, and you'll like them more. | ||
| Jonathan (Jonathan) Username: Jonathan Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.143.178.131 |
Well, seeing as the tickets were gifts anything is a bonus really. Plus I'm seeing them in my home town, Nottingham. I love Nottingham. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
Does the city's logo have a sans sheriff font? | ||
| Huw (Huw) Username: Huw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 218.168.188.34 |
Proto - glad to hear that you enjoyed Dean Spanley! I'm hoping to see it soon. I remember enjoying the novel by Lord Dunsany (upon which the film is based). Haven't seen Burn After Reading yet, but I thought No Country for Old Men was good. | ||
| Protodroid (Protodroid) Username: Protodroid Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 78.152.208.87 |
Huw, perhaps it was just my mood at the time, but I LOVED Dean Spanley. I won't say any more, it's the kind of film you have to discover for yourself. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 67.116.103.241 |
Actually, NCFOM kinda compliments BAR... there's something about both that feels similar, vaguely similar... I dunno... the face of tragedy, vs. the face of comedy, both of them of the bleaker variety.... But Huw, and Weber? If you liked NCFOM, then all I can imagine, is that you'd love BAR. You too Ally.... | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.52.161 |
I'll get on to it Craig :>) | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.159.51 |
Just a footnote... got back this evening from a London demo against the bombing of Gaza, and specifically against the UK's failure to take a stand against it and separate itself from Israel in terms of arms sales and diplomatic support. The demo as such was orderly, a great peace demo and a model of different communities uniting: Moslems, Jews, Christians, Marxists and whoever; pacifists, socialists and whoever. I've since learned there was some violence after, don't know much but that's a sad postscript to a positive and meaningful day. Love and peace to you all. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.245.48 |
P.S. The BBC estimates the size of the demo as 50,000 people and quotes the Chief Officer of the Metropolitan Police as saying that some 200 people were involved in aggressive protest that was unrepresentative of the demo, and resulted only in one broken window. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.168.4.162 |
Well done Joel - if anything else for simply acting on your beliefs. | ||
| Karim Ghahwagi (Karim) Username: Karim Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 80.167.124.223 |
There was a pro Israeli rally in Copenhagen today-some 500 people I think- tensions are high, there were some 5,000 people only a couple of days ago protesting the situation in Gaza. There was some violence both times. | ||
| Simon Bestwick (Simon_b) Username: Simon_b Registered: 10-2008 Posted From: 86.24.165.182 |
Joel- glad it went well and that you got back OK, mate. Other than that, what Tony said above. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.215.33 |
More information coming through, though the Stop the war website is temporarily shut down – apparently there was some fighting, with both policemen and demonstrators injured, but only two dozen arrests. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.242.126 |
Put a large amount of people together like that, add a contentious issue, and there's always a fight. Only two dozen arrests after a demo involving 50,000 is actually a pretty good result. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.145.163 |
Let's hope Boris Johnson agrees. I suspect he won't, at least publicly. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.242.126 |
That's thje problem, isn't it? This type of stuff gets spun into something more by people who want to tarnish it. Glad you managed to miss the trouble, btw. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.147.202 |
Thanks, Zed. I think the demo was over by then, though not long over. | ||
| Allybird (Allybird) Username: Allybird Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 79.70.24.49 |
Glad you got home safely Joel. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.231.208 |
The best way to end this, is for one side or the other to simply surrender, to the tender mercies of the other. Not negotiate peace-talks, cease-fires, etc. - surrender. Lay down their arms and surrender. Take a chance on peace, with the world watching on, and surrender. Just, surrender. ... (Yawn) I'm going to go take walk down to the donut shop and buy something tasty and unhealthy and down it with coffee. I wonder what's on TV tonight?... | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.161.253.10 |
Craig - I have been coming to this same conclusion. I'm going with the jam-filled. No - seriously - I think to drop weapons is the best step too. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.16.85.227 |
The day one side or the other lays down their weapons... soldiers and civilians alike... the day they go out into the streets, and all together, open their arms to their enemies, letting come what may: good or evil, harm or help, let God witness from above - and the world, with cameras running - what will transpire... is a day, alas, none of us will ever see... I think we'll all see a UFO landing, before we see this happen.... Jelly-filled it was! And there's nothing on. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.0.112.152 |
>>>I think we'll all see a UFO landing, before we see this happen Funny you should say that, because your vision was beginning to remind me of INDEPENDENCE DAY. >>>witness from above - and the world, with cameras running - what will transpire Hmm. | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.161.253.10 |
Let's all pretend we are at peace. Sounds like a Bradbury story... | ||
| Hubert (Hubert) Username: Hubert Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 78.22.229.226 |
"I think we'll all see a UFO landing, before we see this happen.... Jelly-filled it was!" I suspected as much. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 212.121.214.11 |
Read Ray Bradbury's "A Piece of Wood" I think it's in the illustrated Man or possibly Golden Apples. There's no hope for our ignoble species. |