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Jonathan (Jonathan)
Username: Jonathan

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 91.143.178.131
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 05:22 pm:   

Right, just finished reading Ally's eclectic collection so just some quick thoughts. There's quite a lot of stories, so I'm not going to go through each one individually, rather I'm going to give general impressions.
I think that when Ally hits the mark there's a great poetry and beauty to some of these stories, and she's superb at nailing atmosphere. This is especially true of The Caul Bearer and Bull Running. The only thing I'd say about the latter is that I thought it could be a bit longer, there was a novella dying to burst out here and actually, I could see it making a decent novel. There's the pilgrimage itself, which could set up a lot of complex character interaction and then there is the bull running itself, plus the weird occult stuff. There's so much stuff going on that a short story really doesn't do it justice.
When Ally gets the pacing right though, you do get powerful, often moving stories. I was particularly struck by The Conical Witch and, in ways, it reminded me of Graham Joyce's brilliant novel The Limits of Enchantment. There's the thread of subtle magic and a woman's power that prove a heady mixture here.

Overall, I think that this is a really diverse collection and shows an emerging voice that is at times powerful and often mysterious. It's a voice I look forwarding to hearing a great deal more from. I think the collection would have benefitted from being a bit leaner and playing to its strengths, but overall these are stories that are very much worth reading.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.63.24
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 09:12 pm:   

Thanks for the comments Jonathan!

I'm actually working on a longer project at the moment - a novel. It's interesting to expand themes and characterization from short story length to 90k or so. I'm totally immersed in that fictional world and am enjoying it although I'll want to write some more short stories again by the summer.

I'll have to get hold of the Graham Joyce book. I have just looked it up and I like the idea of it. I'm always fascinated when folklore/ancient tradition meets science.
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Jonathan (Jonathan)
Username: Jonathan

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.69.92.119
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 09:38 pm:   

Excellent news Ally. I look forward to seeing what you'll produce.

Limits of Enchantment is brilliant. A very powerful and moving book, it made me fairly publicly cry buckets when I was reading it on the train home from work.
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Steve Bacon (Stevebacon)
Username: Stevebacon

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 90.211.103.83
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 09:45 pm:   

I enjoyed this collection a great deal, too. Many of the stories are so different from anything else I'd read, encompassing a blend of genres and moods.

Looking forward to the novel, Ally.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.63.24
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 11:24 pm:   

Much appreciated Steve!

I'm pleased that the stories struck a chord with you.
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.151.125.173
Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2009 - 06:18 pm:   

I am reading this at the mo...Will review when done!

gcw
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.122.108
Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2009 - 09:04 pm:   

Looking forward to it GCW!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.126.53
Posted on Sunday, April 19, 2009 - 02:36 pm:   

GCW. I'm the child sitting in the back of a car - 'Are we there yet?'
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.151.125.173
Posted on Sunday, April 19, 2009 - 08:22 pm:   

:-) - Nearly Ally - be patient!

gcw
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.155.24.109
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 02:50 pm:   

I’m starting another of my real-time reviews. This time it is of ‘Bull Running For Girls’ a collection of short fiction by Allyson Bird (Screaming Dreams 2008). [My previous reviews are linked from here: http://weirdmonger.blog-city.com/recent_reviews_of_books_by_dfl.htm ]

The Caul Bearer
This story is sheer Innsmouthian magic, a tale of a fishing community – swept by brutal survival, old wives’ tales that somehow come true, closeness to darkness and to the Great Fish Soul, the loss to the sea and the complementary gain (spectral and real) back from the sea. The archetypal cycles of death and life, and womanly feelings that ride that very slow rollercoaster of cycles.
It means a lot to me this story as it sits in a similar basket of flither and fiction as my own Madge Stories – and amazingly, coincidentally, I started re-reading ‘David Copperfield’ the other day, for no particular reason, and at its start there is the same legend of the caul that this story starts with. All things, all manner of things, connect.
“They were so rotten you could peel out the spine of the fishermen as easily as with fish.”
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.155.24.109
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 03:10 pm:   

The above is just a taster of the beginning of my review. As and when (fast or slow) I read each of the stories and try to 'gestalt' all the stories' various leitmotifs, my real-time review of the book will actually appear piecemeal here:
http://weirdmonger.blog-city.com/bull_running_for_girls__by_allyson_bird.htm
i.e. not on this RCMB thread.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.38.36
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 03:58 pm:   

Thank you Des. I really appreciate you reviewing my collection. I'm fascinated to read what you think of it all, already.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.155.24.109
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 04:34 pm:   

My pleasure, Allyson. Done the 2nd story now. Amazed at the coincidence of this being late June! :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.38.36
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 04:52 pm:   

The title story is set in late June 2003 - '4,000 dead in Spain and over 18,000 in Italy by the end of summer.' It really is a strange coincidence that you are reading it today of all days. It is cooler up here on the moors though.

It's an important experience for me - reading your real-time review. I'm very much alongside you as you write.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.155.24.109
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 04:56 pm:   

Thanks, Allyson. I can't promise how quickly it shall be done. But I always seem to do these reviews quicker than I ever expect. But if a domestic crisis turns up or if the heat gets into the realms of that Spanish event in 2003.... :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.38.36
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 05:16 pm:   

No problem. Whenever you can will be great.
Thankfully it has just started raining up here. I think I'll go for a walk in it.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.33.24
Posted on Tuesday, June 30, 2009 - 10:32 pm:   

3rd story up. This is such a unique experience. It's like having my own subconscious talking to me.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.15.218
Posted on Wednesday, July 01, 2009 - 01:07 pm:   

It took many years of waiting for Hunter's Moon to come to the surface and demand to be written. Bordeaux was the perfect setting with the flashbacks to the terrible fire in Manchester.

Just a little secret to share, Des - the ghost woman who was wearing the brown buckskin was Calamity Jane :>) surname Martha Jane Cannary Burke, although I spelt it Canary.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Wednesday, July 01, 2009 - 01:50 pm:   

Hey, missed that about Calamity Jane! :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.15.218
Posted on Wednesday, July 01, 2009 - 01:53 pm:   

Nothing much usually does though :>)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.100.94
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 07:50 am:   

[Story notes removed]
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Zed (Gary_mc)
Username: Gary_mc

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.96.241.143
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 09:18 am:   

Des hates story notes. He tore them out of my book.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 10:16 am:   

Ah - right. Thanks Zed. If I had an edit button I'd get rid of it and put the typo right too. Perhaps Gary Fry could remove these last few posts?
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.26.61.140
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 10:27 am:   

Done the Great Soprendo style.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 04:23 pm:   

That's a shame. I think Story Notes are OK as long as I don't read those for a particular story before I review that story. I was joking about tearing them out from Gary Mc's book. Or I was on my 'Intentional Fallacy' high horse at the time. :-)

However, I am not reading Gary Mc's no doubt brilliant intro in BULL RUNNING until I've reviewed the whole book.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 05:53 pm:   

I suddenly felt very vulnerable when I actually woke up and asked for them to be removed this morning. I'm never sure just how honest to be on an open forum.

And I do like talking about intentional fallacy :>) but can we have another thread for that if we want to go over it again.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 06:04 pm:   

And I'll always treasure Zed's intro :>)
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 06:08 pm:   

Is that what they call it these days?
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 06:28 pm:   

Weber - you have a mind like a dirty mack.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 06:54 pm:   

Done the sixth story ahead of time. :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 07:27 pm:   

THE BONE GRINDER - I had my mother's bones in my house after her cremation. As the story states the bone grinding machine didn't work that well so I didn't get ashes. Combine that with staying in an hotel in Derby (AltFiction 2007) where strange goings on kept me awake all night. The tender girls served breakfast and as I looked into their eyes I suspected what was going on. There's always a third thing to add with my stories... so Manchester changed for Derby, holding my mother's remains, and the plight of women sold into the sex trade. Setting...the personal... and the political.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 08:00 pm:   

This Charles Birkin?
'The stories of Charles Birkin, however, are not for the squeamish. Be warned, if you are at all sensitive, leave him well alone. He deals unflinchingly with such subjects as murder, rape, concentration camps, patricide, mutilation and torture.'
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 08:37 pm:   

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Birkin
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.52.33
Posted on Thursday, July 02, 2009 - 08:40 pm:   

Indeed.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.49.152
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 10:05 am:   

THE CONICAL WITCH - I had just read the wonderful OUR LADY OF DARKNESS by Fritz Leiber and couldn't get Corona Heights out of my head.So - I looked out of my bedroom window to see what was visible from my home and saw the old farmhouse and the track that was to be featured in my story. One line from Leiber, amongst others, stuck in my head too - ' A rather thin, pale brown rock detached itself from the others and waived at him.' This led me to thinking about 'figures' that blend in with things or indeed do not blend in with the landscape - hence the description of my witch.

The little girl, Lotte, of my story, is the girl mentioned in the Edith Wharton epigraph but she is also all children who move (or who are moved) from innocence to experience as in William Blake's Songs of Innocence and Experience.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.49.152
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 01:58 pm:   

Des. http://marinas.com/view/lighthouse/983_Metal_Man_Light_near_Rosses_Point_Sligo_B ay%2C_County_Sligo
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:45 pm:   

Tbanks for the photo of the Metal Man! :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.78.49.152
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:48 pm:   

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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.75.131
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 10:02 pm:   

The tenth story. THE CELESTIAL DRAGON. I have relatives who live in Hong Kong. So I know Macau and Lamma Island well now. I know the Man Mo Temple and the underbelly of China that links to HK.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.189.147
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 11:12 pm:   

That doesn't surprise me, Allyson, judging by the story.
BTW, I've now done 'The Critic'.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.75.131
Posted on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 11:32 pm:   

Scooting over to your site............
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.66.74
Posted on Saturday, July 04, 2009 - 11:59 am:   

I'm not going to mention story notes on all the stories but yes...WINGS OF NIGHT. Obviously, mostly fiction, but I did work in The Royal Exchange Theatre in Manchester.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.166.188.174
Posted on Saturday, July 04, 2009 - 12:46 pm:   

Obviously, mostly fiction...

========
Obviously, too, any critic of this book must treat what he or she reads as pure fiction in a book of fiction stories. Anything else outside the stories themselves could be misleading. Or, if not misleading, extraneous, extraneous because what is important is already within the stories ... self-evidently.

Having said that, I find an Author's comments on their own work separately interesting in themselves, but only after the event of reading and describing/interpreting/evaluating the text either formally in a review or inside the head as one reads it....
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.69.161
Posted on Saturday, July 04, 2009 - 05:07 pm:   

Three more stories done. Fascinating. The home stretch is in view, Des :>)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.69.161
Posted on Saturday, July 04, 2009 - 05:23 pm:   

IN A PIG'S EAR. One of the inspirations for the story, below.
http://www.tca.uwa.edu.au/pig/pig_main.html
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.54.232
Posted on Sunday, July 05, 2009 - 02:44 pm:   

DISSOLUTION. Inspired by Simon Callow's biography of Orson Welles (born in Kenosha). Mentioned in the biography is that Orson claimed that his grandmother had an altar in the attic. The story grew out of that.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.54.232
Posted on Sunday, July 05, 2009 - 04:05 pm:   

SILENCE IS GOLDEN. This story was written in two halves - Autumn 2005 and Spring 2008. So..... the first half was written not long after my mother's death and the second just a few weeks after my sister's demise. I think I was sick of coffins by then.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.54.232
Posted on Sunday, July 05, 2009 - 07:12 pm:   

DEATHSIDE. Indeed the end. That was quite a journey Des and it was a wonderful experience to take part in the small parallel observations too. I read the real-time review of that last story and shed a tear too.

Thank you so much, Des.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.159.146.201
Posted on Tuesday, July 07, 2009 - 09:49 am:   

Thanks, Allyson. I can truly say that it has been my most interesting experience so far in the real-time reviewing experiment of mine; it presented the most productive challenges of leitmotifs-into-gestalt and 'Intentional Fallacy' reconciliation.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.42.193
Posted on Tuesday, July 07, 2009 - 11:28 pm:   

One more note. THE SILK ROAD which appeared in the British Fantasy Society publication New Horizons and earlier in my collection was set in URUMCHI and delved into the problem of the Han-Chinese being brought in to 'dilute' the population.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.159.146.201
Posted on Friday, July 10, 2009 - 11:53 am:   

I note from the news headlines today that a British person was gored to death during Bull Running in Spain yesterday.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.118.211
Posted on Friday, July 10, 2009 - 07:23 pm:   

Yes - saw that, Des. Of course that is sad but he chose to run with them. I decided not to learn how to parachute jump when I saw the video of a woman who had landed on a boulder and spit her leg from ankle to knee.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.163.171.146
Posted on Monday, July 13, 2009 - 12:48 pm:   

This was left as a comment on the review site:

Steve Jensen left...
Monday, 13 July 2009 10:57 am :: http://stevenjensen.wordpress.com
Excellent and interesting review. :-)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 79.70.118.211
Posted on Monday, July 13, 2009 - 09:10 pm:   

Happy to hear that
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.169.218.237
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:25 pm:   

Someone just told me on facebook this won best collection at BFS.
Wow! Congrats, Allyson!
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:41 pm:   

Blimey, I hope that's true, Des - that would be absolutely fantastic news. :-)
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.169.218.237
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:52 pm:   

Damien G Walter said so in real-time from the convention.
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:59 pm:   

Amazing news! I'm so happy for Ally, and for Screaming Dreams. :-)

Here's a list of results:

BFS Short Story Competition: Patrick Whittaker, Dead Astronauts

Best Newcomer: Joseph D'Lacey

Best Novel: Memoirs of a Master Forger by Graham Joyce (William Heaney)

Best Novella: Tim Lebbon

Best Short Fiction: Do You See, Sarah Pinborough

Best Graphic Novel: Lock and Key

Best Artist: Vincent Chong

Best Film: The Dark Knight

Best TV Programe: Doctor Who

Best Small Press: Elastic Press

Best NonFiction: A Life in Books

Best Magazine: PostScripts

Best Collection: Bull Running for Girls, Allyson Bird

Best Anthology: The Mammoth Book of Best New Horror.
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 218.168.185.23
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 01:47 am:   

Congratulations, Ally!
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Chris_morris (Chris_morris)
Username: Chris_morris

Registered: 04-2008
Posted From: 98.220.97.79
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 07:47 am:   

My my. Well done, Ally! Congrats!
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Steveduffy (Steveduffy)
Username: Steveduffy

Registered: 05-2009
Posted From: 86.169.5.183
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 10:23 am:   

She shoots, she scores. Wahey!
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.65
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 12:49 pm:   

Again, Ally, couldn't have happened to a better person. Or a more talented one. And a BFS award with your first collection! Wow!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.230.153
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 10:25 pm:   

Thank you for posting Steve! Thanks to you all! So tired ..............x
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.156.38.102
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 11:38 pm:   

Congratulations Ally, and sorry we didn't get to see you before we left!

gcw
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.230.153
Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 07:11 am:   

No probs! Managed to get about 5 hours sleep but don't intended to come down for at least a few more days :>)
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.169.218.237
Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 09:58 am:   

Blood in Madness Ran

That madness again. Here, for me, all comes together, in a glorious Vancean fantasy masterpiece of Legends of the sea and of history and of mythology, underpinned as it is by many of the previous stories (including ‘The Caul Bearer’, ‘The Sly Boy Bar and Eatery’, ‘In a Pig’s Ear’ &c.) and by Gulliver’s Travels... This should win awards. Enough said. Worth the admission price alone. [Without going back in time, it is impossible for me to tell whether this story-in-itself would seem quite so great without the previous parts of this book permeating its bull-runs or surfing-tides, with the book’s earlier tutoring of me to easily absorb mixed protagonists and changing narrative points-of-view, its fast moving jumped-started conclusions of disbelief-neutralisation, its Legends mixed like absinthe ... and more.]

“Small sly faces with eyes the colour of green ice laughed back at her as she offered her breast to each in turn.” (5 July 09 - two hours later)}
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.230.153
Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 10:16 am:   

When I saw your comment on it - it should win awards I thought if only.....
The one thing that kept me going last year when Sylvia died was dreaming that I could win. It got me through the darkness. Really happy today.
Thanks Des!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 05:29 pm:   

Mmmn...discussion. Sour grapes comes to mind.
http://www.britishfantasysociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=2151.msg13675

I've replied - briefly.....
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 05:58 pm:   

And so has Ellen Datlow.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.169.220.250
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 06:01 pm:   

I think the book itself is doing its own form of bull running.... :-)

Good on it.
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 06:07 pm:   

It's a real shame that this kind of criticism should be aimed at a female BFS Award-winner. I've just looked at the history of the Awards, on the BFS website, and aside from Special Awards there have been few female winners in the Society's history; so it's a pity that there's been some 'sour grapes' on this rare occasion (ie two female nominees winning Awards at one event).
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 06:42 pm:   

I think the book itself is doing its own form of bull running....

Des - That is the first time I've smiled for days.

Now - all I have to do is stop feeling sick.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 07:12 pm:   

Ally - stop feeling sick. You've no need to. Unless it's due to some other cause. But if it's to do with these comments about you winning this award, just ignore them.

(and if it is some other cause, get well soon)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 07:39 pm:   

No - the first one. I've opened a bottle of wine :>)
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 09:18 pm:   

I wasn't aware there was any reason to be anything other than pleased as punch for Ally.

People who think otherwise are nothing more than reactionary dickheads.
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Skunsworth (Skunsworth)
Username: Skunsworth

Registered: 05-2009
Posted From: 89.242.185.98
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 10:30 am:   

Just blogged about FCon - have briefly put my thoughts on the situation in there:

www.simonkurtunsworth.wordpress.com

Plues there's a nice picture of me and the landlord...

S
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 11:01 am:   

I woke up this morning feeling slightly better but in a (what the hell is it going to be today mood) then I saw your Fantasycon report and I felt much better :>)

Thank you, Simon!
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 11:17 am:   

Great post, Lord Simon. Your blog is always a good read. :-)

I await the withdrawal of those BRFG/BFS Awards critics from consideration for next years Awards,
in light of their firm, objective and principled stand...[/sarcasm]
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:28 pm:   

Lord Simon!? There's room enough for only ONE Lord in these parts!

Simon will just have to settle for a Knighthood for now.
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John Llewellyn Probert (John_l_probert)
Username: John_l_probert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.229.90.65
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:32 pm:   

Thank you Professor Fry for realising how unseemly and ungracious it would have been for me to have had to step in there
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:35 pm:   

Oh, anyone can buy a title off the internet; for example, I am Viscount of Moravia and Lemuria-under-Sea.
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Stu (Stu)
Username: Stu

Registered: 04-2008
Posted From: 86.29.178.194
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:36 pm:   

On the downside addressing someone as Sir Simon makes it sound like the speaker has a stutter.
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John Llewellyn Probert (John_l_probert)
Username: John_l_probert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.229.90.65
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:40 pm:   

BOUGHT the title? My dear fellow I earned that moniker with years of wearing velvet jackets, silk ties and shirts, underwear from Saville Row and trousers from the four corners of the globe. In fact my next purchase will be an opera cape that I intend to wear to such functions as Lady P & I can get to on our hectic schedule
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:49 pm:   

I was referring to the so-called Lord Simon, not the acknowledged arbiter of literary and sartorial style.
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Matthew Fryer (Matthew_fryer)
Username: Matthew_fryer

Registered: 08-2009
Posted From: 90.202.180.103
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:56 pm:   

I'm all for debate and criticism, but I'm rather disappointed with the snipey tone of some of the BRFG detractors. Hope you feel better Allyson.

For what it's worth, I reviewed it a few weeks ago here:
http://matthewfryer.wordpress.com/
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Zed (Gary_mc)
Username: Gary_mc

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.96.240.106
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:58 pm:   

"There's only one Lord P!"

"Come and have a go if you think you're hard enough!"

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John Llewellyn Probert (John_l_probert)
Username: John_l_probert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.229.90.65
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 12:59 pm:   

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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 01:02 pm:   

"Come and see the violence inherent in the system. Help! Help! I'm being repressed!"
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 01:22 pm:   

Wow - thank you for posting that Mathew! You've lifted my spirits even more. You really came along for the adventure - didn't you? :>)
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 01:36 pm:   

Excellent review, Matthew. :-)

I'll link you from my website:

http://stevejensen.eu
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.156.38.102
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 01:49 pm:   

I have been noticing the furore over Ally's win...

Personally, I am very pleased for Ally. Like all decisions there will always be disagreement, But whether you agree with a decision or not, it is gentlemanly (is that sexist?) to accept the judges decision.

There is no need to harp on about it, it just sounds like sour grapes.

I reckon.

gcw
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Gcw (Gcw)
Username: Gcw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.156.38.102
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 02:24 pm:   

..Also...

I didn't agree with the now fairly hundrum Doctor Who winning best TV show over the vastly more adult & intelligent Battlestar Galactica.

But hey, so what?

Not worth going on about.

gcw
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 02:41 pm:   

Exactly, I was seething last night at the obnoxious tone of some of the comments on that other site. Disappointment at your choice not winning is no excuse for petulant mud-slinging and this was a display of jealousy and sour grapes worthy of the school playground.

But I suppose that's one of the prices of critical acclamation Ally will just have to get used to. People, eh...
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 03:17 pm:   

I dunno, maybe it's just me, but I felt there was an underlying tone of petulant dismay to those posts; something along the lines of 'I don't like it because I was beaten by a girl...'
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.163.171.145
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 03:38 pm:   

I feel sorry for Mark to some extent, as we all say things on sites on the spur of the moment - which we regret or express wrongly...

Also he has said recently (and publicly) he hasn't been fully fit. If that's still the case, Mark, get well soon.
des
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 03:44 pm:   

The sour grapes has been going on for years - Des. Matt on Shocklines had to ask him to stop it last year. The thread there is very long.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 03:58 pm:   

LAST YEAR...Shocklines Aug 2008.
'castingtherunes1 wrote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
it seems to me, Mark, that, merely by posting a 'We don't want no stinking awards' picture on the back of a nomination announcement, then re-posting it into another thread when the original was deleted, then opening up a completely new thread on the subject, plus having done pretty much the same when the British Fantasy Awards nominations came out a few weeks ago, you're suggesting strongly that they are of significance - - to you, at least.

Christopher
Well, I feel it's quite in order for someone to poke fun at awards and not expect to be censored for it. I know it's Matt's board and he prefers enthusiastic responses (which are the norm), but surely one or two differing views are healthy imo. The "we don't need no stinkin' awards" picture is supposed to be a bit of a joke.

As for the other point you raise, I can only reply "of course". I'd be lying if I said that I believe my own work was undeserving of recognition. The reason for this is that folk bang on in particular about awards as if they're a sure indication of achievement. Maybe I've been sucked into the illusion. And then reacted against it. Naturally, awards do sometimes reward good work. But they are also voted on, in my opinion, for name-recognition, networking, friendship, etc etc. This does happen.

Awards are no big deal. Sometimes they go to the deserving, sometimes not. It's a bit of lottery. Surely it's not wrong to point that out? So I'll turn the question around, if I may. Why is that award winners in particular are so eager to defend them?

Seriously, if awards were done away with altogether, what's the worst that could happen? I'd think it'd be a breath of fresh air.

Mark S.'



Further down.............

marksamuels wrote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, I feel it's quite in order for someone to poke fun at awards and not expect to be censored for it. I know it's Matt's board and he prefers enthusiastic responses (which are the norm), but surely one or two differing views are healthy imo. The "we don't need no stinkin' awards" picture is supposed to be a bit of a joke.


Mark,. in case you missed my post from the other thread, here's my explanation.

---------------

Mark, the reason I removed your post before was that it comes off as sour grapes.Let me say, I think you're an amazing writer. I think you know from when I was carrying your books that I 'm a huge supporter of your writing.

Also, I don't think there's anything wrong with starting a thread on here debating the merits of an award.

But to come on someone else's thread saying how happy they are to get a nomination only to say (I'm paraphrasing here) "ehhh...awards are bullshit" is only serving to rain on someone's parade. I think that's poor sportsmanship. Debate it elsewhere, even on another thread on here. Don't take a dump on someone else's good news. You wouldn't want someone to do it to you if you were posting about getting a book deal with someone, only to have someone come on YOUR thread and say "ehhh..that publisher sucks."
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.163.171.145
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 04:21 pm:   

Yes, you're right, Ally.

But I hope Mark will come back to us - and we can all be friends again, friends carrying on with their wonderful writing, which is what it is all about when one day there will be celebrated books by all of you in the annals of Horror Fiction. :-)
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Matthew Fryer (Matthew_fryer)
Username: Matthew_fryer

Registered: 08-2009
Posted From: 90.202.180.103
Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 04:37 pm:   

Thanks, Steve.
Linked you too.
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Mark West (Mark_west)
Username: Mark_west

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.131.3.48
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 01:50 am:   

Didn't realise this was going on until I read Simon's blog about FCon - really sorry to hear about the detractors but hey, at the end of the day, you and your collection won (I know this probably doesn't help, but I feel I should present a positive message!). End of story! Enjoy the sensation, enjoy the time and now get cracking on new material!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:54 am:   

It does help Mark! And I have the honour of being in the history of the BFS, now.

Simon Kurt Unsworth is the master of disguise on facebook. You'd never guess it was him. :>)
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Skunsworth (Skunsworth)
Username: Skunsworth

Registered: 05-2009
Posted From: 92.28.161.58
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 12:47 pm:   

It's not. It's someone else.

S
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 01:36 pm:   

I wish Sir Simon would start wearing his legendary lumberjack hat again.
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.37.199.45
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 01:39 pm:   

Des, your idealism is heartening.

Lots of people aren't keen on award systems. I remember Woody Allen saying: "I can't stand award ceremonies. Adolf Hitler, Best Fascist Dictator." Not believing in awards is fine.

Though obviously, someone damning an individual who has won an award that they wanted to win is something else again, and cannot be judged a principled stance.

Des's other comment, regarding Mark, is a reminder that we rarely know the context of posting. For most of us it's more like phoning a friend than writing a letter to a newspaper. We don't really believe anyone outside the forum will know or care what we say.

I'm getting tired of saying it but it's still true: the Internet is no good for people. It represents a deterioration in social skills and language use. People should talk. The other day I saw two youngsters walking down the road, having a conversation, with their voices, and even looking at each other while they were doing it. I wondered if they belonged to some kind of retro historical society.

People post things when they are ill, depressed, drunk, anxious, lonely etc. These get copied and discussed if they were press releases. Writers should be remembered for their writing, not for their ill-judged and unnecessary comments posted from a dark room in the early hours of the morning.

In the spirit of unity, let's criticise and argue when we disagree with something, but also let's not escalate and use words like 'enemy'. We're all people, all flawed, all struggling with the fact that the long-predicted annihilation of literary culture is really happening in our lifetimes and burning down the careers we had hoped to build. It's not easy for any of us.

The old saying 'Ars longa, vita brevis' has been reversed. Life is short, but art (meaning the lifespan of literary works) is much shorter.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.163.171.145
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 01:50 pm:   

What you say is heartening, too, Joel.

There is a fine balance between (a) being held to task for what one says by voice face to face or in print or on an eletronic forum and (b) being forgiven and understood or given deeper context than heretofore or, even, following further discussion, proved right or wrong.

The internet can play its part in all that fine balance as well as creating the unbalanced problem in the first place!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:02 pm:   

Mark Samuels should apologise, publicly to me, and to the British Fantasy Society for undermining the awards.
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Joel (Joel)
Username: Joel

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 217.37.199.45
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:33 pm:   

Yes, he should, but if he doesn't then an attempt to pressurise him would drag in lots of other people and perpetuate an argument that should have ended before it began. Des is right: countering an argument with a considered response is enough, and escalation is never ever a good idea.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:39 pm:   

I've been feeling ill with high blood pressure for a week since all this started (and haven't been able concentrate on my work) since that comment.
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:48 pm:   

Although I'm inclined to empathise with Mr Samuels in the light of his personal problems, most people have heartaches and problems of a similar nature at some (perhaps many) times in their lives. For example, my dad had cancer for years but finally passed on at a time when we were confident of his recovery; this resulted in me suffering from depression. However, I did not take out my grief or my mental suffering on others, not even online...

Sadly, this controversy genuinely seems to be an instance of sour grapes, regardless of anyone's supposedly-objective views on Allyson's work.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.163.171.145
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 02:52 pm:   

I suggest a cooling-off period. Is anyone in contact with Mark? I haven't got his email address.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 04:43 pm:   

Ally, as an uninvolved but concerned outsider (getting an insight into the politics of the writing game as it were) I have to agree with Joel.

Sometimes a dignified silence is the best defence against ill-considered comments and I believe this is one of those times. Let your work speak for itself from here on in and learn from this experience. You've proved yourself a great writer but that doesn't mean everyone is gonna love your children.
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Stu (Stu)
Username: Stu

Registered: 04-2008
Posted From: 86.29.187.161
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 04:59 pm:   

Mark is indeed having a shitty time of it recently.

Ally, sorry you're not feeling well.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 05:09 pm:   

Thanks Stu. I appreciate that.

Stephen - 'Sometimes a dignified silence is the best defence against ill-considered comments and I believe this is one of those times. Let your work speak for itself from here on in and learn from this experience. You've proved yourself a great writer but that doesn't mean everyone is gonna love your children.'

As much as it is very kind of you to say that I'm not thinking about that last sentence. I'm talking about being professional/challenging democratic decisions etc...just for clarity.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 12:48 pm:   

Mark Samuels on the BFS.
http://www.britishfantasysociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=2151.30
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 01:43 pm:   

I have now added this as a footnote (in the form of a blog comment to my own review):

"In answer to Mark Samuels (BFS member) and Johnny Mains (non-BFS Member) - who have gone out of their way to express their conviction that this book is an unworthy winner of the BFS Award for best collection - I would say that that is a moot point. I hope I have shown above that, although BULL RUNNING is imperfect (as I point out in various places in the review), the aftertaste and its resonating emotion outweigh the imperfections, given a proper study of the book. That is not to say that the other contenders for the prize (which, other than the King, I have also done real-time reviews for in the past) are not worthy winners, too. It's just that it's feasible that ALL of them are worthy winners and it was the voting that decided in the end, as it should."
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 02:02 pm:   

Hooray for Caroline C:

If Ally has been seen as "aggressively marketing" her book, I'm not sure that's something she should be admonished for. Bear in mind that, at the time, her publisher was seriously ill. Ally therefore took it on herself to market the book. Good for her - that shows initiative, concern for her publisher to do the best by him, and concern for the genre and the small presses generally in that she wanted the book to succeed (as well as, of course, wanting it to succeed from her point of view, as the writer). In my opinion, writing a book isn't just about the art. If you want people to read it, it has to be marketed.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 03:50 pm:   

I could pretend it's a different Caroline C!

Seriously, don't read that one paragraph out of context. I've also stated in my post on the BFS forum that I think Johnny and Mark have now made their points (which I think previously had been misconstrued, certainly by me anyway) clear. They're perfectly entitled to their opinions if they don't like the book, or - in Mark's case - don't like the award system either. It's just a shame the points were initially made in rather an "awkward" way.

It's such a shame that all this has happened (a) because Ally should be celebrating a great achievement, fairly attained, and (b) we are all on the same side - or should be. We all want to see a strong showing for the genre, a strong small press (as well as more works by genre authors done by larger publishers too, of course). We should all be CELEBRATING the genre - not letting personalities/politics get in the way and ripping each other to bits.

Here endeth the sermon ...
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 04:11 pm:   

Oh shit! I think I give up. I don't know whose blog this is (maybe he or she should have the courage of their convictions and provide their real name?), but this is really vicious:

http://horrorworldwatch.blogspot.com/

Not just Ally, but just about anyone and everyone involved with the BFS comes under attack here (go down to the first blog as well as the later one). Ok, I know I've said that everyone is entitled to their own opinions - and I guess this person is too - but this infighting just sickens me. It brings the whole genre into disrepute - what hope is there for horror, really?
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 04:17 pm:   

It's not so bad! In a funny way he (it feels like a he for some reason) seems to be agreeing with you...
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 04:18 pm:   

Er, I have no idea what's going on mind - just dipping my oar in as per, instead of writing...
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 04:32 pm:   

Don't despair Caroline.

All this whingeing says absolutely nothing about the horror genre or writers or award systems but speaks volumes about good old human nature.

Every field of human endeavour is riven by the same infighting and politics whether it be working in an office like myself or counting penguins in Antarctica.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 04:32 pm:   

I have left a short rejoinder on that blog as comment, but it needs to be approved before being seen.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:27 pm:   

>>In a funny way he (it feels like a he for some reason) seems to be agreeing with you...<<

I hope not agreeing with ME, Tony - that's not what I was trying to say at all!

Thinking about it on the way to the shops just now, I think perhaps it's intended as a spoof - not to be taken seriously. If so, then I reckon it's a spoof too far. Way too far.

I also think I know who might be responsible for it (but I'm not saying). If it is who I think it is, then I'm oscilating between sympathy and contempt for them - not sure which way to go.

Anybody want to come and live in a cave with me, to cut ourselves off from the world completely? Oh, wait, then I wouldn't be cut off if someone came with me. No, I'll just go on my own ..
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:28 pm:   

BTW sorry for the expletive above. Am I allowed to say "sh*t" on this board? It just kind of came out.
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 218.168.183.181
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:31 pm:   

Sure you are. I think. Don't go over the top, though, or GF will send the ghost of DI Harris over to deal with you...
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:37 pm:   

Words you're allowed to use


shit, piss, crap, yoni, soapytitwank, arse, bottomburp, (why is this so much fun to type?) toot-toot, willy, plonker, fuck etc

words you're not allowed to use

sausages, blancmange, sausageblancmange

you have been warned
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:45 pm:   

Ever get the feeling these 'critics' are actually enjoying this completely unnecessary and degrading controversy? After all, there's only so much mileage in a 'principled, honest and objective' stance; the masks are fully off now and what is revealed is tantamount to (carefully-disguised) sexist bullying.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 05:57 pm:   

I think Dwelleronthefringes deserves an award for shit-stirring. You can just see the twisted smirk and maniacal glint in his eye as he was typing that. And it most definitely is a he.

Well done sir!
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Steve Jensen (Stevej)
Username: Stevej

Registered: 07-2009
Posted From: 82.0.77.233
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 06:07 pm:   

I think Dwelleronthefringes deserves an award for shit-stirring.

I doubt he'd accept it; awards are worthless, apparently.
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 218.168.183.181
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 06:30 pm:   

Has nobody yet realised that 'dwelleronthefringes' at 'Horrorwatch' is our old pal CB? C'mon guys, you're slipping...
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 06:38 pm:   

A bit, Caroline! I imagined the name 'Allyson' out from the post he'd done and it all seemed reasonable - if that was the way the person who might be Allyson was going on. What I must hurriedly add is that I haven't followed this story at all, so probably shouldn't even chip in... :-(
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 07:12 pm:   

Er, Tony, you've completely confused me now.
* scratches head *

But I definitley haven't been intending to say what that guy says in his (spoof?) blog. I hope no-one else thinks that (or else I might use another expletive .. oh sausages).
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 07:22 pm:   

The blog has taken its comment boxes down now - since I complained to Horrorwatch on the VoE site that my comment wasn't shown.

I also said that the blog seemed designed to make everyone feel more uncomfortable in this argument (ie. everyone on all sides of the argument, in fact) and to raise the temeperature of debate for its own sake.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:17 pm:   

Huw - seems you are right. So...Horrorwatch is JK (Shocklines) is CB. The connection - Johnny Mains, Mark Samuels, CB all posting on the Vault of Evil together.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:19 pm:   

Caroline!
Just seen the beginning of that post. Yes; it's all clicking into place now (shivers at old memories).
I thought the guy was saying people shouldn't fight, that when they do it makes the genre look bad, which is sort of what you said - I think. But looking at the beginning of it it just feels like another stir of the wooden spoon.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:20 pm:   

......On that thread
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:20 pm:   

Oh, those guys shiver my timbers...
Enormous well done Allyson, and never promote your books ever again!
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:42 pm:   

Phew, glad you've realised I'm not saying the same thing as that guy, Tony - I was worried for a minute there!

But I've no idea who JK or CB is (I wasn't here then and don't use Shocklines) so I might have been wrong in my assumption about who it is. Good thing I didn't say who I thought it was, wasn't it!
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Mick Curtis (Mick)
Username: Mick

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.180.45.136
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:46 pm:   

I'm going to dinner with the author of Bulll Running for Girls!!! Along with several other people though...
Chris Teague has sorted out the Pendragon Press table for the WorldCon Banquet, and it includes Ally, Steve Upham, Simon Clark, John Travis, me and Debs and a fair few more folk! Bring on the chips!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:53 pm:   

Okay Tony - I promised I'll never promote a book again when my publisher has heart failure and is in hospital for weeks :>)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 08:56 pm:   

Mick - really looking forward to that :>)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 - 09:24 pm:   

And CB now reveals himself at the end of that Vault of Evil thread.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 04:44 am:   

Who or what is CB...???

I have no clue.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 07:43 am:   

Stephen; you know in Harry Potter when really, absolutely, it's best not to mention Voldemort's name? This is such a situation.
Even this will be picked up on.
Huddle close, everyone...
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:25 am:   

Steve - the person suggested has been involved in many an attack against people connected to Ramsey in some way.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:34 am:   

He is often known as Julian Karswell (on TLO these days). Ignoring some well-founded criticisms of his on-line approach (perhaps an understatement), he is a knowledgeable person on Weird Literature etc, published the first two Reggie Oliver collections and has a book coming out from Ex Occidente Press (as by CB) which I have pre-ordered and intend to real-time review to see if the 'money is where his mouth is'! :-).
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:37 am:   

Hubert - when I went to bed last night I thought about Machen/The White People and your comments ....

I wrote BRFG's through three bereavements and read widely during the writing of it. The influences are many but include, Lovecraft, Ramsey Campbell, Hemingway, Orson Welles, Christina Rossetti, Edith Wharton, R. L. Stevenson, Yeats, Shakespeare, Bram Stoker, Boccaccio, Keats, William Blake, Virgil and Crowley.

Caroline - yes. I agree with what you said on the vault about being bullied by them - not a pleasant feeling.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 10:07 am:   

Des - there's a difference between CB and Julian Karswell in that Julian was a bit more sociable and seemed a little more self aware.
I tried understanding him for a while as I could see where he was coming from, sort of, but it went wrong; his mind sort of goes into overtime and he questions things a little more than the rest of us. It'd all be quite acceptable if he wasn't so darned offensive with his retorts.
He really is one prickly hedgehog.
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 10:17 am:   

Joel;
'I'm getting tired of saying it but it's still true: the Internet is no good for people'
I'm becoming more inclined to agree. I saw Nicholas Roeg presenting a film last year and he felt the net got a lot of people talking but not doing; he said for things to get done people had to meet face to face. I think the net is an illusion, or like one. But we become addicted because it's like gambling; sometimes, when it works, it's the best place on earth, but at other times it can be crueller than anything. I must admit it's stopped me writing as much as I should. I just can't pull myself away.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 12:25 pm:   

People post things when they are ill, depressed, drunk, anxious, lonely etc. These get copied and discussed if they were press releases. Writers should be remembered for their writing, not for their ill-judged and unnecessary comments posted from a dark room in the early hours of the morning.

That is the most insightful comment on this thread so far. As a non-writer I've been guilty of all the above at one time or another but thankfully not childish mischief-making (to put it mildly).

The Internet is a useful tool for meeting like-minded individuals and keeping in touch with distant friends but when it becomes obsessive to the point of taking over one's identity (a bit like those online RPGs) then harm is certainly being done.

For the record Facebook and this Message Board (purely because of my admiration for Ramsey Campbell) are my only dabblings in cyberspace - and I think I'll keep it that way...
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Tony (Tony)
Username: Tony

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 81.157.22.201
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 02:00 pm:   

People have been killed because of facebook relationships you know...
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 02:19 pm:   

>>Who or what is CB...???
I have no clue.<<

Stephen - never fear, I was in the same position. I've been enlightened a bit now though.

Now, I wonder if I dare pop over to the Vault again today and see if my late-night tantrum last night has got me kicked off ...?

(Thanks, Ally, I've been the victim of internet bullying twice on autograph collecting boards - no, don't laugh, I'm serious! It's a horroble thing)
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 02:20 pm:   

.. or even "horrible"
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 03:48 pm:   

Tony, someone you talk to solely on Facebook or here or even the ISC scrabble site (forgot about that one) should never, ever be thought of as anything other than a (hopefully) like-minded individual.

As soon as disagreement sets in and that person starts making assumptions and getting personal without actually having met you that's when the harm starts being done.

It's a constant battle to hold on to your sense of perspective, not to mention reality, when "chatting" online. Joel is so right...
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 04:49 pm:   

Joel is indeed right. But the Internet is a new discourse we need to learn, I'm afraid, for good or ill.
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Barbara Roden (Nebuly)
Username: Nebuly

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 216.232.181.247
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 07:25 pm:   

Hilarious post from our friend CB. I found this especially funny: "Curiously the glasses-wearing Roden uses a fifteen year old photograph sans spectacles on her numerous blogs and websites. Is this simply a casual oversight or is it an example of a woman wishing to trade upon more youthful looks?"

Yes, I normally wear glasses; no, I'm not in that pic, because I was on my way to a banquet. I'm flattered, though, that CB thinks it was taken 15 years ago (when I was 30). It was taken 2 years ago, when I was 43, in the lobby of the Holiday Inn in Minneapolis. Present in the full picture are Tim (our son), and Neil Gaiman, who has just signed Tim's copy of M IS FOR MAGIC with the words 'This is the first copy of this book I've signed!', said book having gone on sale in late June 2007, two days before we got to Minneapolis. In the picture Tim is holding the book cover outward, so the front can be clearly seen, and this would seem to establish the date of the picture. . . .
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 07:57 pm:   

Surprised that CB didn't know that picture was taken alongside Neil Gaiman.
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.97
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:04 pm:   

Barbara - seeming as I'm a bit of ladies man round here (just ask them), and seeing as you look magnificent in said photo, may I add you to my list of potential women in the business who may just give me a foot up the ladder?



Ally - I know you're upset by what a certain somebody said, and that is understandable, but remember everyone has your back, and yes, it will be construed as sycophants blindly protecting you from the likes of CB, or whatever he's calling himself these days, but let him devote hours of his time wasting his talents as a writer by pouring all his energies into it. You SHOULD never doubt yourself. Don't let people make you think EVER, that you need defend yourself. An opinion is an opinion, but outright character assassination of your skill and talents as a writer, and of those around you, of some of the guys on this board is simply the delusions of one man convinced the world is against him because he believes quite sincerely that he is right and everybody else is wrong. There's no point in trying to engage with him. So don't.

Don't let this ruin your moment. You are one of a few to have a won an award like this. You should be proud and deaf to those determined to make you feel otherwise. And I know that nobody would vote for you because of promotion or because of your good character.

I know that again will be or could be warped into a 'what does this idiot think...that there isn't a lot of back slapping and back scratching going on', but quite honestly, it's something to keep him up at night, not you. Okay?

And while I'm not a big fan of awards, I think any award in this genre is worth much more than a lot of other awards because of the mainstream's avoidance of usually recognising any other form of literary merit.

Anything that pushes forward the genre is welcomed by most, I'm sure.

Right, I'm off to peel some spuds.

We all love you, Ally. So relax and get cracking on that keyboard.
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Barbara Roden (Nebuly)
Username: Nebuly

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 216.232.181.247
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:09 pm:   

Gary: I don't know if I've posted the full pic anywhere online. And I must be one of the few people who's cropped Neil OUT of a picture of herself.

Frank: Thank you for the compliment! And I'd say yes, but I'd be accused of flirting shamelessly.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:20 pm:   

Barbara: I think you may have mentioned it once or twice, though.
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:28 pm:   

Hubert - when I went to bed last night I thought about Machen/The White People and your comments ....

I'm flattered, Ally Kidding aside, we so seldom discuss what attracts us in good horror fiction or what we think it does to us - which you'll admit is remarkable considering the number of 'field' people here.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:30 pm:   

Thank you Frank! Tomorrow I write! : >)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:32 pm:   

Very true Hubert and thank you for the support! Much appreciated!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:34 pm:   

Hubert...support = talking to me :>)
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:49 pm:   

Ok, Ally. Understood

I haven't properly followed the ins and outs of this debate, but it goes without saying I'm unreservedly on your side.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 08:53 pm:   

Thank you for the support ..deja vu...
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 86.157.25.85
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:03 pm:   

Universities are now running Degree Courses on the ins and outs of this debate. :-)
I've already had two researchers asking me for clarification on its genesis and its cross-thread dénouement. ;)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:05 pm:   

I can follow evey bit of it..:>)
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:35 pm:   

I've already had two researchers asking me for clarification on its genesis and its cross-thread dénouement. ;)

Not to mention the ramifications of certain more nebulous explanations, or that recent recourse to a palpable amount of discourse when addressing anciliary matters unredeemably in tatters.
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Huw (Huw)
Username: Huw

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 218.168.196.228
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 09:51 pm:   

One day this 'debate' will be someone's 'specialised subject' on Mastermind!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.198.192
Posted on Wednesday, September 30, 2009 - 10:27 pm:   

:>)
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.93.21.74
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 01:47 pm:   

"Des - there's a difference between CB and Julian Karswell in that Julian was a bit more sociable and seemed a little more self aware."

Well, Karswell is still out there. I'm fascinated that he doesn't share his other persona's opinion of my stuff.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 02:20 pm:   

Expletive imagined......how many has he got?
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 02:21 pm:   

...persona wise.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.93.21.74
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 02:31 pm:   

Good question, Ally, since he's now denying that he's "behind" Horror Watch, where he appears to be the only poster. On the Google groups he has more names than a dog has fleas, but clicking on "Find messages by this author" reveals them.
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.93.21.74
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:12 pm:   

Gosh, there's already a response to this in another place. It's almost like having a conversation.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:23 pm:   

Bloomin' heck that was fast..
Yes 'real-time'..........
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:26 pm:   

Where is this reply?
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:29 pm:   

Who is he, who is he, who is he???

I'm not very good at all this clandestine intrigue and have already scratched master spy from my list of possible alternate careers.

I get an impression of some sad lonely individual who was once Ramsey's No. 1 fan until some imagined slight occurred. Am I right?
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:34 pm:   

Ah, I found it. It's on the horrorwatch wotsit.
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:39 pm:   

At which point has anyone on this board stated that - and I quote - " that Mark Samuels and Johnny Mains - the Vault Of Horror posters who came under such intense flak for querying aspects of the BFS's recent award process - are in fact Barker. "

Who the hell is this idot on the horrorwatch blog?

No one has suggested that mark samuels is Barker - considering that several of the people on this board know both people personally... I know you're reading this mr horrorwatch - you really do seem to be just a shitstirring twat.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 194.32.31.1
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 04:52 pm:   

Are you barking Weber or do you mean that CB is... NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This really is getting all a bit silly imho.
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 05:03 pm:   

More than a bit silly. Whoever horrorwatch might be, we know it's not albie because it's not written well enough although it does share Albie's paranoid tendencies and persecution complex.

He's just a bit sad really. Not really worth bothering with.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 05:27 pm:   

So don't.
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.76
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 05:37 pm:   

Now, now, Prof, Weber's only saying what's been said before. Put your happy head on, the administrator one doesn't suit you.
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.76
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 05:54 pm:   

Hey, does having your name in virtual print via Horror Watch count? I'm rather flattered to see myself quoted.

Whether or not Cb is bound up in the Unholy Trinity, I believe my support for Ally is not whether people should be allowed to voice their opinions, but the manner in which criticism is voiced. There are no sacred cows at any level, there will always be somebody who disagrees, and this is healthy, but the critique in question makes me wonder whether or not they realise how unprofessional in tone it was. I would expect that criticism to at least demonstrate/reflect the qualities and professional insights of a professional writer. I see nothing wrong in finding fault with a low-brow approach in this criticism when the critic issues similar charges against all and sundry.

Again, thanks for quoting me. The only time I'm likely to see my name in print this year

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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 06:31 pm:   

Woah! Not read all of the new stuff here yet, and I've got to dash to go do hubby's tea, but I can assure you that Johnny Mains has nothing to do with Horror Watch, CB (whoever he is), or anyone else like that. Be back later ...
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.76
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 07:22 pm:   

Just to add further clarification about the lack of professionalism shown towards making a critique, check out the following link:http://marksamuels.wordpress.com/ which uses a football analogy to hammer home what could be best described as very amusing peek into the troubled mind which chose it in the first place.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 07:38 pm:   

Unbelievable.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Thursday, October 01, 2009 - 08:35 pm:   

Doesn't this quote from HorrorWatch mean that he's let slip that he IS this Barker fella?

"Barker has not criticised Bird's book. Samuels and Mains did. Barker defended their right to do so, a right that the BFS and its lickspittle serfs sought to deny them."

Or maybe I'm just getting confused ...

Anyway, I'm quite sure HW isn't Johnny Mains, as I stated above before I went off to sort out the tea.

Dem on the Vault had the courage to tell HW to "go away" (roughly translated!), and I see he's now come under attack too. Unbelievable (to echo Ally, on a different matter).
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 12:47 am:   

Ah right - Carnival of Souls. I saw it horrorwatch.
http://horrorworldwatch.blogspot.com/
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 02:48 am:   

Having a go at the other female again now are we.
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Simon Bestwick (Simon_b)
Username: Simon_b

Registered: 10-2008
Posted From: 86.24.165.182
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 09:56 am:   

What. A. Fucking. Prick.

Scuse my French.

(Was going to use another word, Ally, but I know you don't like it.)

Ignore this shit. It's the only way. Horror Watch is the work of a dishonest, manipulative shit-stirrer, who's now cloaking misogyny in sanctimonious rhetoric. Who follows his blog? Does anybody read it except the people here? Let him kid himself he's making a difference or having the slightest influence on anything anywhere. He doesn't. Unless you let him by reading this shit and letting it rile you up.

Life is too short to piss away on devoting time to venomous crap spewed out by the mentally ill. Those of us who are writers- we're here to write. Let's get on and do instead of feeding trolls.

As for Mark- I'm sorry to hear he's unwell. He can have a habit of making statements online that he regrets afterwards. Incidentally, I note he's taken the Damned United clip down from his website. I don't class him in the same group as the people who've deliberately inflamed the issue.

And that is going to be the only comment I make on this whole sorry circus. The shit-stirrers who started this are thriving off the oxygen of publicity. Quite frankly, they don't particularly deserve the oxygen of oxygen.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 10:04 am:   

Yes but the clip from youtube The Damned United Brian Clough's first day as Leeds manager shocked me greatly with accusations of cheating and such. I didn't sleep at all last night and at this rate he won't be the only one who is unwell.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 10:33 am:   

If it's making you ill, don't read it.
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.79
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 11:40 am:   

Prof - I think you'd feel the same if it were such a direct attack on you. Ally has every right to read it and feel pissed off about it. I know you are only trying to help, and you're probably more right than wrong, but how many of us would not be tempted to see what somebody was saying, especially when it seems unwarranted.
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 11:41 am:   

They're all just silly sausages.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 11:56 am:   

I've been attacked frequently, but it's never made me ill. It couldn't.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 12:21 pm:   

So if attacks from three directions on this scale were aimed at you in a week it wouldn't affect you?.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 12:36 pm:   

As I said, it wouldn't make me ill. And if it did, I wouldn't keep reading it.
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 12:46 pm:   

Ally - did you count any of these people as friends before all this kicked off?
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 12:53 pm:   

I have no idea what you mean Weber?
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Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston)
Username: Weber_gregston

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 194.176.105.47
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 01:03 pm:   

If they were friends before this started then there is a valid reason to be upset. Even in that case, just cross him off your christmas card list and ignore his little rants. If these are just random twats having a go for their own sad little sourgrapes reasons then there's really nothing to make yourself ill about.

They're just idiots and don't take what they're saying to heart. It all seems to stem from the fact that they're jealous you won.

In MS's eyes at least you couldn't possibly have won because you wrote a good book, there had to be more to it, so he's made up his little paranoid fantasy and he's been backed up by the sort of lowlife you find floating round the interweb.

there's nothing to worry about.

Relax, chill to some soothing music and get your significant other to give you a long soothing massage.

If he's not available I'll pop over tonight...
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 01:04 pm:   

But now I do feel ill.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 01:18 pm:   

Johnny Mains was angry with me last year because I self-promoted on the vault (my publisher had heart failure)so he couldn't do anything. JM posted some vile posts aimed at me but he deleted them and I left the board.

CB swiping because well - who the hell knows?

As Simon/I mentioned previously the Damned United analogy has been taken down now. 'In MS's eyes at least you couldn't possibly have won because you wrote a good book.' He won't accept that people liked the book and voted democratically.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 01:21 pm:   

Seriously, Ally, I can understand how this is upsetting you as it would upset me if it was aimed at me too (maybe us ladies are a little more sensitive about such things than the men?), but I also think the guys are right - don't let it get to you, or even try not to read it.

I've no idea what that Mark Samuels thing was about (as soon as I saw it was a footy clip, I didn't bother watching it!), but HorrorWatch is clearly just attention-seeking (if he is who we think he is, it's a damn strange way to plug his new book!). If no-one's reading the blog, then there's no point in him doing it. He's only continuing with it because he knows it's getting to people. Leave his blog alone and there won't be any point in him keeping it up. He's had a go at several people here - not just you, Ally - but are they bothered? No, because those are the views of just one sad person and they don't matter one jot.

I know it's easier said than done, but please do try to ignore it all, Ally, for the sake of your health and peace of mind.
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 01:26 pm:   

BTW I was reading something the other week in one of those awful women's magazines that you have no option but to read when you're sitting in the hairdressers (that's my excuse!). It was about someone who'd been prosecuted for bullying on the internet - first example of it's kind in the UK I think. Maybe some of the folks who start up this kind of thing should think carefully about that before they start? They could find themselves in serious trouble - defamation, harrassment, etc ...
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Frank (Frank)
Username: Frank

Registered: 09-2008
Posted From: 213.158.199.89
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 02:19 pm:   

Simon (Bestwick) - mate, I realise Mark Samuels is a friend, or colleague, and I think you are a fair and decent individual, somebody I would, I'm quite sure, be able to sit down and have a chat to over a pint...BUT...if Mark is ill he needs to stop exerting himself posting the football analogy one moment, then rushing to take it down the next. And if he's sincere, or as sure of his convictions as he seems to be (I could be wrong), then why did he remove the 'Damned United' clip in the first place?
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 04:18 pm:   

Managed to get some sleep at last and feel better now.

The worst thing for a victim of bullying is for people to tell her to forget about it.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 04:21 pm:   

Remember what happened when my daughter was bullied at school last year and not hiding away gave her the strength to fight it?
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 04:28 pm:   

>>The worst thing for a victim of bullying is for people to tell her to forget about it.<<

Sorry, that's not what I meant really - not "forget about it" in that sense. Just the "don't let it get to you" sense (if I'm making any sense whatsoever?).

A bully feeds off their victim's fear. If the victim doesn't show fear (or irritation, or any other negative emotion), then the bully has no reason to continue. It's simply attention-seeking behaviour - if no-one pays them any attention, then it's no fun for them any more so they stop.

That's my theory anyway, but I may be wrong. We all have to deal with things in different ways. All I can say, Ally is, find the best way for YOU to deal with it.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 04:34 pm:   

Exactly, Caroline.'find the best way for YOU to deal with it.'

I wasn't afraid Caroline - merely tired.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.119.63
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:11 pm:   

G'day all. The whole furore is fascinating (although not for Ally B.)to an outsider. The Barker/Karswell hybrid seems to be flailing at innocent bystanders (Ally B. etc) who just happened to be prominent at one particular point in time: in this instance it was the BFS awards and the ensuing controversy arising from them. It seems to me that this was merely a hook upon which to hang his neurosis.
Removing the innocent bystanders from the picture for the moment, it looks as if the hybrid's fundamental target is the BFS - Messrs. Campbell and Jones in particular. His virulent attack on them suggests he has some kind of serious and unresolved grievance.
Perhaps there's a story not yet told in its entirety here; can Ramsey C. or Steve J. shed some more light on this character's motivation?
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Carolinec (Carolinec)
Username: Carolinec

Registered: 06-2009
Posted From: 82.38.75.85
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:22 pm:   

>>Perhaps there's a story not yet told in its entirety here; can Ramsey C. or Steve J. shed some more light on this character's motivation?<<

I'm not sure they'd want to on a public forum, Alexicon, even if they knew. I'd say that only the individual concerned knows his motivation for doing what he's doing.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.119.63
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:38 pm:   

Hi Carolinec. Point taken - but I still think AB should derive considerable comfort from the fact that she is only 'collateral damage',horrible term. Through no fault of her own, she was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:39 pm:   

Hello - pleased to meet you whoever you are and no it isn't me catching on to the 'persona' game.

If this is not resolved with CB (who has attacked numerous writers/artists) year after year - trying to damage reputations - where will it all end?

He has attacked people on this board -year after year and many have been upset by it..
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:50 pm:   

Can you explain a little more...
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Chris_morris (Chris_morris)
Username: Chris_morris

Registered: 04-2008
Posted From: 12.165.240.116
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 06:52 pm:   

>> where will it all end?

I suspect it will end when the BFS comes to its senses and bestows an award upon Mr Barker, at which point he will be forced to attack himself for cronyism and self-immolate.

I am of the opinion that Ally's recent awards success was fully merited. However, I must admit that I do often find Mr Barker's attacks strangely amusing, much in the way one finds a weird uncle amusing. I do not in any way mean to suggest that I agree with him, of course, and I suppose I shouldn't encourage such things. Still, I can't help it. Probably I feel this way because I have never been a target for his abuse?

It may be worth noting, however, that horror literature and its aficionados are not the only target for CB's curmudgeonly rants:

http://tinyurl.com/yepd9bn
(check the comments section)
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:01 pm:   

My computer won't let me access it.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:02 pm:   

>>>where will it all end?

I think it will end where people let it end.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:07 pm:   

We haven't finished discussing this yet. Alexicon might have more to say that will help me..
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:10 pm:   

Okay, but if you do this in a public forum, remember that all can see.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:13 pm:   

I'm not doing anything but wondering why I'm attacked viciously from three directions. Ramsey has already stated earlier about CB being JK.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.119.63
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:14 pm:   

Hi Allybird. It' s indeed a pleasure to meet you - albeit electronically.And please don't think I'm CB!! God, now even I'm becoming infected...

The question is - does he do this in other areas,or is the spite solely directed at the horror genre? If the latter,one can almost imagine that he's had a couple of self-styled 'masterpieces' rejected and then felt spurned because his brilliance hasn't been recognized. It's likely: I know of abnormal and unstable people in other areas who have reacted to rejection like that.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:16 pm:   

About personas..from Ramsey. 'Good question, Ally, since he's now denying that he's "behind" Horror Watch, where he appears to be the only poster. On the Google groups he has more names than a dog has fleas, but clicking on "Find messages by this author" reveals them.'
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:17 pm:   

Earlier up the board...
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:23 pm:   

No - I was suggesing that someone might think that I was a persona of Alexicon - joking:>)

Trouble in other areas too I think, Alexicon. Don't think he's ever been nominated for an award in the horror field. CB - is a horror writer and has a collection coming out soon. Could be one of the problems.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.119.63
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:47 pm:   

So,Allybird...it's a kind of a preliminary,negative
promotion for his book? Clever stuff. He could be a marketing genius then!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.101.248
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 07:56 pm:   

Sigh - could be. At my expense - we've all been played for fools but there is more I think...
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 75.5.10.238
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 10:13 pm:   

I'm lost.... Maybe someone could do a where-we-are-now summary, listing characters and their names/affiliations, so the ignorant bystanding gossip-mongers among us (like me) can get up to speed.

So is Clive Barker attacking you, Ally? If so, well, NOW I'm jealous.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Friday, October 02, 2009 - 10:20 pm:   

No Craig, first name wrong - you make me smile :>)
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 03:00 am:   

Thank God for Craig!!

Because I thought it was Clive Barker too but was afraid to ask mainly because I love the guy's work. I mean what was I supposed to think with all these references to a CB and a Mr Barker.

I feel an overwhleming surge of relief at this news... phee-ew!
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 08:44 am:   

Now. I really am laughing - all that time you thought that? Sort of see where you are coming from as you have missed the many discussions of the other one on this board. One day over a pint you'll get the whole history, Steve. Craig - if I'm ever out your way, the same :>) Clive Barker would never do that and he doesn't even know I exist.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 01:19 pm:   

Talk about feeling a dumbo... thanks Ally lol.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 01:46 pm:   

I dunno. I had that Stephen King fella chasing me recently. Kept saying he was my number one fan. He stole my book Lisey's Story, too. Bastard.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 01:48 pm:   

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qR2o2YYqEck&feature=PlayList&p=F088B1D188B60873&p laynext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=20
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.107.241
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 02:24 pm:   

Okay,folks - here's the killer question:

Apart from DFL, has anyone ordered the Heroic Outsider's book?
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Ramsey Campbell (Ramsey)
Username: Ramsey

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 195.93.21.74
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 02:41 pm:   

I have.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.107.241
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 03:00 pm:   

Did you request a signed dedication,Ramsey?

There's irony here.
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 03:03 pm:   

Funny you should mention that. The other night I met Shirley jackson on the bus. Told me she was going uptown, to see a Mr Harris (whom I don't really know).
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 03:07 pm:   

(in reply to Gary's Pete and Dud link)
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.107.241
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 03:18 pm:   

It's a small world,Hubert! I was having a drink with Wally Harris the other night,and he actually mentioned that a Shirley Jackson was going to visit him. What's she like?
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 04:14 pm:   

You think that's bad. Last night, after a full day in the factory, I got home, wiped my hands on the curtains, fumbled off my suit and got into bed. Then . . . it happened. Again. Tap, tap, tap at the bloody window.

So I got up, and who was there? Perched on the top of a ladder wearing only a see-through neglegee?

Only Peter Straub, wasn't it?

"No, Peter," I recall shouting. "Not tonight. I'm exhausted. I've got muck under my nails and in worse places."

But he wouldn't listen. Kept phoning me.

It's hard being me.
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 81.153.249.0
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 04:40 pm:   

I often get Sir Charles Birkin at my bedroom window.
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.87.38
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 04:43 pm:   

"It's hard, being me." Now Gary,this is filth.

As the thread is Bull Running for Girls may I offer a valedictory post:

Allyson - your collection is superbly refreshing; your award is richly deserved; and I sense you are on your way to great things.
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 75.4.254.8
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 05:26 pm:   

Hey, Stephen, I'm just glad I'm not the only one who was confused and lost and mixed-up on the players here....

So just one more question: Are you going to stop doing what you did to make them hate you so much, Ally?...
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Mick Curtis (Mick)
Username: Mick

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.179.61.66
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 05:47 pm:   

I often get Sir Charles Birkin at my bedroom window.

With me, it's usually Greta bloody Garbo.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 06:41 pm:   

Craig - Mmmm. Let me think about this for a minute. That would be no.

Thank you! Much appreciated.
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Gary Fry (Gary_fry)
Username: Gary_fry

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 82.3.95.168
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 06:46 pm:   

Nice to see you sounding chirpier, Ally.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 06:50 pm:   

Thanks Gary! Much happier.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 06:53 pm:   

Going out for a Chinese banquet too. It is about time I celebrated .....
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Mick Curtis (Mick)
Username: Mick

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 86.179.61.66
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 07:39 pm:   

I read that as "going out for a cheese banquet" and thought - why not?
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 10:17 pm:   

A bit spinsterish I'm afraid, Alexicon, but after some small talk about (I gather) her mischievous son Charles she visibly thawed. Of course then I had to mention that letter I got from Jimmy the other day, which spoiled it all. I'll try and make amends and tell her you know Mr Harris. It should work a treat.
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Allybird (Allybird)
Username: Allybird

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 80.47.222.21
Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 10:21 pm:   

And ....vindication/off with vilification and in with an other celebration!

6 hons and 1 in the Ellen Datlow book!
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 06-2008
Posted From: 81.153.249.0
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 01:16 am:   

Well done, Allyson.
des
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Alexicon (Alexicon)
Username: Alexicon

Registered: 10-2009
Posted From: 88.106.101.13
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 03:55 am:   

And there are still unresolved issues on this thread which need urgent attention!

Firstly,Hubert: huge mistake mentioning Jimmy's letter to Shirley,particularly as you already knew she was a spinster,and you were also aware {having read the letter in question) that it contained allegations that her illegitimate son Charles was in fact sired by Wally Harris.For heaven's sake,Hubert,don't mention to Shirley that I know Harris because it'll make me look bad in her eyes if I bump into her in Asda.

The two remaining - indeed disturbing - posts to be addressed refer to Sir Charles Birkin appearing at Des's bedroom window and Greta Garbo visiting Mick. I think Gary's visits from a transvestite Peter Straub are fairly easy to understand,although I feel his description is a trifle louche.But Birkin and Garbo? Different ballgame altogether...

I've discussed this with my colleagues at the Queen's Head tonight,but unfortunately I'm too exhausted to offer incisive psychological insight into the Garbo/Birkin visitations right now. My dog hates drunks,so when I return home in a crapulent condition,the bastard attacks me like some werewolf: I've just spent fifteen minutes wrestling him to the floor;and now I'm getting stick from my lady for breaking some B&Q Ming vase. Meanwhile,the dog looks smug while I take the stick. Seriously,I'm just too tired to continue.

Alex
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Craig (Craig)
Username: Craig

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 75.4.251.233
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 04:18 am:   

I just had sex with Talulah Bankhead, if anyone cares.
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 10:43 am:   

I'll take the train next time around, Alexicon

By the by, Brigitte Bardot and Claudia Cardinale are both off limits as per now. I had a visit from them both yesterday evening. It all began with a tappping, as if someone gently rapping, rapping at my chamber door.

" 'Tis some visitor," I muttered, "tapping at my chamber door; only this, and nothing more."

Alas, I was mistaken.
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Stephen Walsh (Stephenw)
Username: Stephenw

Registered: 03-2009
Posted From: 82.4.18.104
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 02:09 pm:   

Great to hear you back to your old self Ally!

Just think - you're not only an award winning author now but "controversial" as well - that has to be good for your work. I think "Clive" et al may have done you a favour...
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Hubert (Hubert)
Username: Hubert

Registered: 03-2008
Posted From: 78.22.230.15
Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 03:55 pm:   

Are you controversial, Ally?
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Des (Des)
Username: Des

Registered: 09-2010
Posted From: 81.155.31.11
Posted on Wednesday, February 09, 2011 - 06:09 pm:   

HOLIDAY by M Rickert (Golden Gryphon Press) seems to be a perfect story collection for lovers of Aickman, as well as of writers such as Allyson Bird whose collection BULL RUNNING has, for me, much in positive resonance with it.

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