| Author | Message | ||
     Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
I just heard about david Jason's "racist" joke... Who the hell would find that offensive. In case this latest racist atrocity has passed you by, on a radio show at the weekend, DJ asked "What do you call a pakistani cloakroom attendant?" and the answer was the horrifically offensive "Mahatma Coat" Apparently, this is stereotyping all asians as cloakroom attendants!!! Course it fucking isn't. Why can't these PC dickheads get a fucking life. the only problem with that joke is that it's not very funny because it's a bad pun (not in a good bad pun way). If he'd used the joke about "What do you call a p*** that doesn't smell?" that would have been offensive as that is a racist play on words. The cloakroom one isn't offensive. This sort of crap really pisses me off. | ||
| Niki Flynn (Niki) Username: Niki Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 78.32.69.29 |
I'm only offended because it's so bad I don't even get it. But yeah, apparently you're supposed to take offence at any joke that mentions a specific race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation or nationality. What a world we live in, eh? | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 129.11.76.230 |
All I can say it: what a ploooonker. | ||
| Steve Lockley (Steve) Username: Steve Registered: 03-2009 Posted From: 86.162.233.55 |
What's more, that joke is more than 40 years old. I heard it as a ten year old - at the same time as the one about the scottish dentist Phil McAvity. Should I now expect complaints of racism from all Scots for repeating something that old too and equally offensive? | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
I suspect the offence came primarily from attributing a Hindu name to a 'Pakistani'. But it's not the answer that's offensive, it's the question. If you can't see why, you're not paying attention. It's a vanilla example of a genre whose primary flavour is insult. The punchline doesn't add to the stupidity, but it doesn't negate it either. | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Well said, Joel. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.5.8.19 |
Christ, everyone calm down. Humorists, if they're proper, "insult" everyone, themselves included. And the only ones who can't laugh at themselves and their own, are priests, dictators, and egomaniacs.... | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.0.40 |
Is the word pakistani now an insult? What are we supposed to refer to people from that part of the world as? | ||
| Gcw (Gcw) Username: Gcw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.151.125.173 |
If I may say... Spike Milligan's Pakistani Dalek sketch makes me cry with laughter. gcw | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.192.168 |
There's a great early Harlan Ellison story called 'Final Shtick' about a Jewish comic who's made his name telling wry, deprecating jokes about his own people. When he's asked to come and perform in the small town where he and his family were viciously abused throughout his childhood, he sees this as his chance to hit back. But when he walks on stage, all he can do is the same self-deprecating crap. It's a part of the culture. The 'Mahatma Coat' joke is indeed decades old. But it's an Indian name, so it's 'an Indian cloakroom attendant'. Why did David Jason change it to the inaccurate 'Pakistani'? Because doing so creates a frisson, a sense of being on the edge of something. If he were in a pub, who knows what answer his mates would roar back over their pints? Then the punchline is a nice little shtick, a clever step back into the innocence of puns. What's this saying to a 'Pakistani' (i.e. Asian Muslim) listener? It's pointing a finger and saying 'Hey, you! You're a... no, it's just a joke. Go on, laugh.' The notional 'you' of the question is not Pakistani – so, by implication, Pakistanis are not 'us'. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.231.100 |
But - and maybe this is my remote American location - the pun's sum-total is, "my hat my coat," not "dirty rotten sonofabitch".... What am I missing? | ||
| Simon Bestwick (Simon_b) Username: Simon_b Registered: 10-2008 Posted From: 86.24.165.182 |
Gcw- You mean this one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0n88tZQc4Q | ||
| Mick Curtis (Mick) Username: Mick Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 86.159.87.217 |
Why did David Jason change it to the inaccurate 'Pakistani'? Because doing so creates a frisson, a sense of being on the edge of something. Is that necessarily so? Maybe he's just ignorant of names in that continent. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 91.110.158.143 |
Craig, the pun is innocent. It's in the question that the disrespect lies. It's a feint or a pass at racism. There's more to a joke than the punchline. | ||
| Craig (Craig) Username: Craig Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 75.4.244.93 |
Perhaps, perhaps.... | ||
| Tony (Tony) Username: Tony Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.23.233.247 |
Play-on-word jokes are ancient, and harmless. This is a non-story. | ||
| Joel (Joel) Username: Joel Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 217.37.199.45 |
Hi Tony. I hope all's well with you. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
Tony - Is it a non-story when a respected actor has just been forced to issue a public apology for telling a harmless joke? Sorry Joel, we'll have to agree to disagree. Following your logic above, no-one should be allowed to tell a joke about anyone from a different racial/religious/ethnic category as apparently it's automatically offensive regardless of the joke. Christ I must really hate the irish for the similar Paddy O'doors joke by that reasoning, and as for edward woodward, I've been telling the "what do you call a man with three planks on his head?" joke for decades. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
Hi Tony. How're things going with you BTW? | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Weber - sorry, mate, but I think Joel is spot on. The intent is in the question. Ironically, the confusion of ethnicity makes it laughable, but not acceptable. I don't think this is a case of political correctness gone wrong, I think it's a case of hoary old entrenched view points of other cultures giving cause for questionable humour. As a country we often pat ourselves on the proverbial backs for being ever so liberal and aware of our distinct and mixed ethnicity, yet we react quickly whenever something like this is called into question. To me that speaks of lazy culpability, and perhaps a subconscious recognition that we know all too well that it smacks of something rather unsavoury. Weber, this is not directed at you or anybody else. Personally, I don't think anyone who's Pakistani or Indian will give a toss, since they've been listening to the same old 'joke's for decades. I suppose this seems somewhat contradictory after Protodroid and I quarralled over the blaqck comedian using the word 'cracker'. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
I'm too concerned about keeping my job and my home to give a fuck about some shite gag Del Boy cracked after a no doubt sumptious dinner. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
Sorry, missed this off:  | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Zed - Like the rest of us, mate.  | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
You appear to be saying that no joke, however innocuous, can be told by a white man about anyone else of any other ethnicity/religion. Hell let's go the whole hog, let's ban jokes about women as well. Let's have zero tolerance on jokes. Why did the chicken cross the road? hang on, vegetarians and animal rights people might get offended. Let's ban all of those as well and force apologies from people that use them, the animal hating bastards. Yes that is a stupid example, but it's on a par with the David Jason incident. There is no racist intent in DJ's joke at all and I know no people of Asian origin who were in the least offended. So why the fuck are middle class white people up in arms about it. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
Because all the asians are too busy out at work in cloakrooms.  | ||
| Huw (Huw) Username: Huw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 218.168.179.191 |
That's a pretty foul thing you did with the chickenist jibe there, Weber. ;-) | ||
| Frank (Frank) Username: Frank Registered: 09-2008 Posted From: 79.187.206.46 |
Weber - Cool down. I'm not middle class. Who said this was a class thing? 'I know of no Asian people who were in the least offended' is no different than saying you're not homophobic because you have lots of gay friends. Here's an experiment you might want to try: Find someone of Pakistani or Indian ethnicity and try one of these harmless jokes on them. They probably wouldn't say anything other than give a sigh of familiar disappointment. Weber - I am not one of the politically correct brigade and I repeat I am not middle class. And even if I was I fail to see what it has to do with this. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.20.31.211 |
Who's "up in arms" about it, anyway? Wasn't it just a few complaints from listeners? | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
If you'd read the stories on Monday you'd have thought he was the new Hitler. @Frank - I showed half a dozen people I work with the joke and 5 of them laughed, one of them pointed out it was an indian not an Asian name and they all said there was nothing to be offended about. And I bet all the listeners who phoned in to complain were middle class white people with nothing better to do than to get offended at something on someone elses behalf who wouldn't be offended anyway. This joke is no more offensive than "What do you call an Irishman who fits french windows?" (answer given in an earlier post). If he'd said that there would probably have been no complaints. He should not have been pressured into giving any apology except for the quality of the joke because it just wasn't funny. You cannot say that a joke is inherently racist just because it's about another ethnic/religious group. That way leads to censorship. | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.20.31.211 |
>>>If you'd read the stories Read where...? | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
Just do a google search on David jason + racist. You'll find dozens | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.20.31.211 |
I did, but most of them involved the kind of folk who post on IMDB. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.96.241.143 |
I did, but most of them involved the kind of folk who post on IMDB. You mean Joe Public? | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.20.31.211 |
Noo, peepul hu spel liek this. Peepul hu say fings liek 'David Jaysun shuld be aloud to say wot he wants, even rasist jokes, cos hes a commede legend.' | ||
| Gary Fry (Gary_fry) Username: Gary_fry Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 82.20.31.211 |
>>>You mean Joe Public? Actually, yeah, you're right. You know, the scum. | ||
| Zed (Gary_mc) Username: Gary_mc Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 213.219.8.243 |
The proles. | ||
| Weber_gregston (Weber_gregston) Username: Weber_gregston Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 194.176.105.47 |
It was mainly the story in the Guardian that pissed me off the most. To put it in perspective, you have to remember that last week I got all wound up about the wording on packets of Walkers sensations... | ||
| Gcw (Gcw) Username: Gcw Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 81.151.125.173 |
"Gcw- You mean this one?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0n88tZQc4Q Yep, I love it. You won't see much (if any) 'Q' series on TV today as it monstrously un-PC. Not just in a racial way...News for the deaf? HELLLO..! Sorry, but it was hilarious  gcw |